Guest The Magnificent 7 Posted May 13, 2019 Share Posted May 13, 2019 There are a lot of criticisms I have of this show this season, but some of the Northmen going crazy in sacking the city didn’t raise much of an eyebrow. Historically, sackings get out of hand for a myriad of reasons and although it wasn’t an attritional siege before entering the city, if you recently lost a ton of your comrades up North fighting an existential threat while these summer softies didn’t even send a thank you note or the soldiers that were promised for the fight you may let the demons get the better of you once the carnage begins. Not excusing it, but it wasn’t shocking to me some went full mayhem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Fowler Posted May 13, 2019 Share Posted May 13, 2019 The best working theory I've seen in the effectiveness of the Scorpions is Drogon had a rider to guide him. But that's just fanwank. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raziel Posted May 13, 2019 Share Posted May 13, 2019 5 minutes ago, The Magnificent 7 said: There are a lot of criticisms I have of this show this season, but some of the Northmen going crazy in sacking the city didn’t raise much of an eyebrow. Historically, sackings get out of hand for a myriad of reasons and although it wasn’t an attritional siege before entering the city, if you recently lost a ton of your comrades up North fighting an existential threat while these summer softies didn’t even send a thank you note or the soldiers that were promised for the fight you may let the demons get the better of you once the carnage begins. Not excusing it, but it wasn’t shocking to me some went full mayhem. I mean, it's not like there are examples of in no way all Northmen being honourable and upstanding and not the "wants to do horriffic things to other people and get off on it" piles of shit that 99% of the population of Westeros are. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Throat Posted May 13, 2019 Share Posted May 13, 2019 4 minutes ago, Brian Fowler said: The best working theory I've seen in the effectiveness of the Scorpions is Drogon had a rider to guide him. But that's just fanwank. Rhaegal was also wounded from the Battle of Winterfell. Dude had Swiss cheese wings. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Throat Posted May 13, 2019 Share Posted May 13, 2019 3 minutes ago, Raziel said: I mean, it's not like there are examples of in no way all Northmen being honourable and upstanding and not the "wants to do horriffic things to other people and get off on it" piles of shit that 99% of the population of Westeros are. Reveal hidden contents Sucks for Jon then that his entire army was made up of Ramsays-to-be. They were on the wrong side in the Battle of the Bastards. I guess they just didn't realize it yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raziel Posted May 13, 2019 Share Posted May 13, 2019 Yes, the Boltons were the only evil shitheads in the entire North, right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Throat Posted May 13, 2019 Share Posted May 13, 2019 That's not what I'm saying. Just because some Northmen are evil doesn't make it likely that Jon's entire army are city-sacking pieces of shit. I didn't see any of them bow out of murdering innocents or try to stop those who were. This is a way of life for the Dothraki. The Unsullied are unfeeling killing machines. Both groups were totally down with this shit. Were Jon and Davos really the only Northern soldiers who thought this change of plans was fucked up? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GuerrillaMonsoon Posted May 13, 2019 Share Posted May 13, 2019 Should have had a Winterfell Vote of Confidence that Dany lost before taking on Mouth of the South Qyburn as her new hand. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest The Magnificent 7 Posted May 13, 2019 Share Posted May 13, 2019 5 minutes ago, Throat said: That's not what I'm saying. Just because some Northmen are evil doesn't make it likely that Jon's entire army are city-sacking pieces of shit. I didn't see any of them bow out of murdering innocents or try to stop those who were. This is a way of life for the Dothraki. The Unsullied are unfeeling killing machines. Both groups were totally down with this shit. Were Jon and Davos really the only Northern soldiers who thought this change of plans was fucked up? I don’t think we watched the same show. Once Daenarys did her thing and Grey Worm “had to get it on” (Heat quote) lots of swords got picked up and it was battle time for a number of people. There was remarkable discipline until that time and then it all fell apart. The officer class keeping order at that point was going to take time. You are always going to have bad people in your ranks and the show has always done a decent job of showing some of the rough customers such as a bunch of dudes in the Night’s Watch at Craster’s, for example. It didn’t mean every swinging dick in the Night’s Watch was a bad guy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Fowler Posted May 13, 2019 Share Posted May 13, 2019 And let's not act like war fines crimes are something extremely rare, even in the real world. The My Lai Massacre, for instance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Niners Fan in CT Posted May 13, 2019 Share Posted May 13, 2019 Just look at the U.S. military. Most of them are good honorable people. But some of them are racist, homophobic, murders, pillagers, rapists.. and a lot of bad shit happens during war time. Some of the northern soldiers doing that wasn't hard for me to believe because of all the stories I've read on real life soldiers doing reprehensible shit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheVileOne Posted May 13, 2019 Share Posted May 13, 2019 I just want an explanation how so many Dothraki are still around after Winterfell. Benioff said it was basically the "end of the Dothraki." It looks like they went back to the Respawn zone and still had plenty left. We didn't see hundreds fleeing from the Wight field. It was maybe a handful at most, and Benioff even confirms this at the end. The writing for this show, Benioff and Weiss, can't keep anything straight. They are truly the Michael Bays of screenwriting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Niners Fan in CT Posted May 13, 2019 Share Posted May 13, 2019 1 hour ago, Brian Fowler said: The best working theory I've seen in the effectiveness of the Scorpions is Drogon had a rider to guide him. But that's just fanwank. The scorpions were never effective against Drogon. Rhaegal got taken out seemingly because he was wounded and it was a surprise attack. Drogon was able to weave through multiple arrows. This time around Dany was prepared. She flew high enough to use the overcast to her advantage and then she flew fast enough so they couldn't reload in time when Drogon circled back through. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheVileOne Posted May 13, 2019 Share Posted May 13, 2019 1 minute ago, Niners Fan in CT said: The scorpions were never effective against Drogon. Rhaegal got taken out seemingly because he was wounded and it was a surprise attack. Drogon was able to weave through multiple arrows. This time around Dany was prepared. She flew high enough to use the overcast to her advantage and then she flew fast enough so they couldn't reload in time when Drogon circled back through. LOL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Niners Fan in CT Posted May 13, 2019 Share Posted May 13, 2019 1 minute ago, TheVileOne said: The writing for this show, Benioff and Weiss, can't keep anything straight. They are truly the Michael Bays of screenwriting. They've fallen off but I think the show is still pretty clearly ahead of the Transformers series in both writing/logic and direction. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Throat Posted May 13, 2019 Share Posted May 13, 2019 I get that awful shit like that happens in war, but that's all we were being shown from the Northerners between Grey Worm attacking a surrendered Lannister soldier from behind and Jon telling them to fall back because the city was being destroyed. All the good Northerners abstaining from war crimes were off-camera? What were they doing? Watching the fireworks? The mutiny at Craster's Keep faced resistance from other men of the Night's Watch. The only resistance here was Jon futilely yelling at them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheVileOne Posted May 13, 2019 Share Posted May 13, 2019 (edited) 2 minutes ago, Niners Fan in CT said: They've fallen off but I think the show is still pretty clearly ahead of the Transformers series in both writing/logic and direction. At least attempt some sort of lampshadey-handwavey excuse. "Like we brought as much of our army as we could. Not everyone could make it yet because most of our ships were destroyed." Edited May 13, 2019 by TheVileOne Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Niners Fan in CT Posted May 13, 2019 Share Posted May 13, 2019 2 minutes ago, TheVileOne said: LOL Are we watching the same thing? It was merely a scratch and then he torched the scene. I wouldn't say it was effective and like I said Dany made all the right moves at King's Landing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest The Magnificent 7 Posted May 13, 2019 Share Posted May 13, 2019 (edited) The good dudes were fighting Lannister soldiers. Which was shown a ton. I mean what would you do if two sides came to battle and a battle happened to break out “unexpectedly”? My good chap, Grey Worm, you really should apologize. Edited May 13, 2019 by The Magnificent 7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheVileOne Posted May 13, 2019 Share Posted May 13, 2019 Just now, Niners Fan in CT said: Are we watching the same thing? It was merely a scratch and then he torched the scene. I wouldn't say it was effective and like I said Dany made all the right moves at King's Landing. Yes. It hit it and clearly did some damage. Had they had more on the field they reasonably could've caught him when he was in his nose dive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Niners Fan in CT Posted May 13, 2019 Share Posted May 13, 2019 2 minutes ago, TheVileOne said: Yes. It hit it and clearly did some damage. Had they had more on the field they reasonably could've caught him when he was in his nose dive. I guess, I think the one Bronn was on was a lot smaller and Dany knew what angles to take at King's Landing. @The Magnificent 7 I'd have to go back and watch but I believe Grey Worm landed the first blow on the surrendered Lannister army. Then the Lannisters started picking back up their swords to fight so the northern troops kinda had to get it on didn't they? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Throat Posted May 13, 2019 Share Posted May 13, 2019 2 minutes ago, The Magnificent 7 said: My good chap, Grey Worm, you really should apologize. Ha! I would've just liked to have more than only Jon and Davos taking issue with what some of their fellow soldiers were doing. Someone else stopping one of their buddies from slitting a woman's throat. Does this mean a good chunk of Jon's army no longer loves him and his bland, honorable ways and are now loyal to the woman who gave them the cue to slaughter innocents? And does it no longer count as a war crime to kill surrendered soldiers if they start defending themselves after being attacked from behind? Good thing their crazy queen won't care about sorting that out to punish anyone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CSC Posted May 13, 2019 Share Posted May 13, 2019 The Bronn shot only hit because of Dany's hubris, figuring nothing the Lannister army had would hurt her dragons. The 2nd time was a sneak attack and Drogon was able to dodge them even at that. This time they were fully prepared, knew more or less where they would be and altered their gameplan. Not sure what is so confusing about how they would be less effective this time. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheVileOne Posted May 13, 2019 Share Posted May 13, 2019 And here people thought Cersei was the big bad. The big bad was Mad Queen Daenerys all along. I can sort of accept Daenerys going mad. She wanted the Iron Throne too much. She believed it had to be her and only her. That's why she's not fit to rule. I mean she's mad. The things she believes aren't even really true. Fans just can't accept the character they've rooted for and invested eight years of their lives into inherited the madness from her father. Granted, then you have David Weiss himself saying Daenerys is "not like her father. She's not a sadist." So as of right now, Benioff and Weiss have proven themselves to be unreliable creators and you can't really trust a word they say anymore. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheVileOne Posted May 13, 2019 Share Posted May 13, 2019 2 minutes ago, CSC said: The Bronn shot only hit because of Dany's hubris, figuring nothing the Lannister army had would hurt her dragons. The 2nd time was a sneak attack and Drogon was able to dodge them even at that. This time they were fully prepared, knew more or less where they would be and altered their gameplan. Not sure what is so confusing about how they would be less effective this time. I mean...if that's the case, they should've been able to land a shot on freaking sadistic and Mad Queen Daenerys in the sacking of King's Landing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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