piranesi Posted August 25, 2016 Author Share Posted August 25, 2016 As often as wrestling audiences have been conditioned to feel sympathy in storyline for the hard-working outsider who is despised and belittled by the people in control or the "boys in the back" but keeps on working and fighting, it shouldn't be surprising that we can suddenly get irrationally forgiving of Miz's shortcomings when it is made so clear that he is an actual real-life hard-working guy who is despised and belittled by the people in control and the boys in the back but keeps on working and fighting. At this point, at least to me, his ring work doesn't even matter. He's a real-life misfit who decided to stick it out and plug through despite ridicule and humiliation and has accomplished about 1000% more than any of his haters thought was possible, since most of them had him flaming out after weeks/months and slinking back to low-grade reality t.v. He's not a main event wrestler, but he's survived as a valuable midcard player in a company that chews those guys up and spits them out. He's helped to elevate people, or at least (in the case of Sandow and let's not forget Alex Riley) did his part to make it possible to elevate them, and it's really not his fault the company didn't follow up. He manages to fill multiple important slots all at once (segment host, comedy stooge, midcard heel to put over new guys, celebrity dupe, easy promo to get dependable heat off most crowds, dependable PR guy). How many people have/can do all of that all at the same time without the shitty parts destroying their usefulness over time? It's not perfect. The storlyine version of this misfit is Daniel Bryan and because that's a worked story, they got to choose a guy who was basically perfect in the ring. Since this is kind of real, it's not so clean cut. Miz isn't the misfit I deserve. But he is the misfit I need right now. 7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt D Posted August 25, 2016 Share Posted August 25, 2016 I think part of the problem people have with Miz' story was that he was a fan without ever being a smark, despite being of the right age for it. He was a fan of all of the elements of the Monday Night Wars that the smart community at that time railed against. I'm not saying that's a valid reason to resent him, but I can see undertones of that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Curt McGirt Posted August 25, 2016 Share Posted August 25, 2016 Terry Funk asked somewhere (the Forever Hardcore doc likely) about whether the guys that didn't bump -- the Hogans, the Ravens -- were the smarter guys in the business, instead of guys like himself who broke their asses through the years. He laughed and agreed with the former. How I want this argument to end ("let's see how this plays out" TM Greggulator) yet I can't help but fan the flames Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MADCAP Posted August 25, 2016 Share Posted August 25, 2016 This is all I see when I see the Miz: 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
piranesi Posted August 25, 2016 Author Share Posted August 25, 2016 Raise your hand if Madcap just posted something that makes you love him more. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MADCAP Posted August 25, 2016 Share Posted August 25, 2016 Hey, I'm not mad. Folks like what they like and I don't begrudge them for it(most of the time) and with that, I'm off this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greggulator Posted August 25, 2016 Share Posted August 25, 2016 * MVP * John Morrison * Alex Riley * Damien Sandow * R-Truth Those are a list of guys Miz partnered/feuded with who were over more than they ever were in their careers after getting tangled with him. He's REALLY gifted in that department. Alex Riley is an all-time terrible wrestler and wrestling persona. He's just awful. But he was good as Miz's stooge and awesome when he finally stood up for himself. Damien Sandow friggin' through himself off of ring aprons. That dumb act wouldn't have worked with anyone else but Miz. Miz's reactions to Sandow made the bit and act click. His partnerships with John Morrison and R-Truth were the only times I cared about those guys. The only thing I really remember about MVP's WWE career was his feud with Miz, which was highlighted by this epic promo that ended with a "This is awesome!" chant. And he also helped get Daniel Bryan over to an awesome degree. Bryan, of course, would become one of the defining stars of his generation and got more over than he was when Miz was tormenting him. But no one else can get someone else over to that degree. He's been a great performer for years. He might not have the ***** classics a lot of our favorites do, but that's not the point. The dude knows how to work and plays his role perfectly. I would very much love to see him get another World Title run. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Curt McGirt Posted August 25, 2016 Share Posted August 25, 2016 Looking at that list, only Truth is still around and only cause Vince loves him probably. Nobody said Miz isn't a good mechanic on the card. But that's all he is, besides a mic god and a lifer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Go2Sleep Posted August 25, 2016 Share Posted August 25, 2016 22 minutes ago, Curt McGirt said: Terry Funk asked somewhere (the Forever Hardcore doc likely) about whether the guys that didn't bump -- the Hogans, the Ravens -- were the smarter guys in the business, instead of guys like himself who broke their asses through the years. He laughed and agreed with the former. Are Raven and Hogan really in that much better shape than Funk or Foley these days? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Curt McGirt Posted August 25, 2016 Share Posted August 25, 2016 Well, this was back in like 2004 or something so hey Meanwhile Funk is still wrestling Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burgundy LaRue Posted August 25, 2016 Share Posted August 25, 2016 3 hours ago, Smelly McUgly said: Most people who are truly great at something the way that Bryan was truly great at pro wrestling are driven in a way we non-great folks can't understand. I love playing basketball. I play it all the time. I played in high school. I can't imagine playing it enough to ever become as great as Michael Jordan even if I had more than a(n extremely small) fraction of his talent. That's what makes Jordan truly great. He destroyed relationships and probably his knees to be great, but there it is. That drive doesn't make Jordan a moron. That drive doesn't make Bryan a moron, either. A lot of people proclaim that they appreciate greatness, but when people put in the sacrifice to get it, those same people often criticize those who are great for having tunnel vision and excluding other things that they deem to be more important than striving to greatness. This part of your post is pretty shitty, tbh. No need to say "you can't criticize either guy for how they made it," which is true, and then immediately start name-calling Bryan for how and why he chose to make it. Call me an outhouse, then. Because risking brain trauma and nerve sensation in your limbs when your wife is asking you to consider otherwise is moronic. Not to mention selfish. Jordan may have busted knees, but his brain still operates fine and he's worth a billion dollars. That's a far cry from what Bryan did. I didn't call Bryan a moron for having passion. I called him a moron for damaging his future for it. I thought that was pretty clear. I mentioned him possibly shortening his life over it. Guess I wasn't clear enough, since you're questioning it. Nearly everyone calls Jordan a class-A asshole. Yeah, greatest basketball player, but a shithole of a person. That's a good philosophy question--would you be willing to give up being a somewhat emotionally normal person to be great at something, even if it meant devastating others along the way? I honestly don't know. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SirSmUgly Posted August 25, 2016 Share Posted August 25, 2016 30 minutes ago, Burgundy LaRue said: Call me an outhouse, then. Because risking brain trauma and nerve sensation in your limbs when your wife is asking you to consider otherwise is moronic. Not to mention selfish. Jordan may have busted knees, but his brain still operates fine and he's worth a billion dollars. That's a far cry from what Bryan did. I didn't call Bryan a moron for having passion. I called him a moron for damaging his future for it. I thought that was pretty clear. I mentioned him possibly shortening his life over it. Guess I wasn't clear enough, since you're questioning it. Nearly everyone calls Jordan a class-A asshole. Yeah, greatest basketball player, but a shithole of a person. That's a good philosophy question--would you be willing to give up being a somewhat emotionally normal person to be great at something, even if it meant devastating others along the way? I honestly don't know. Clearly, it's what he wants to do with his life. I wouldn't, but that's why I'm not a pro wrestler, much less an all-time-great one. I am aware that you didn't call Bryan a moron for having passion. I called you out specifically for calling him a moron because he's wired to be so passionate as to put his life at risk. My point was that people who are truly great at what they are often do damage their lives for it, which I guess is the point that you missed. You think it's moronic to do so because you're a normie who will never be the greatest at anything in life (like me! I'm not meaning to insult you here). You can't understand why someone would be driven that much. Neither do I. But hey, great people put themselves at risk for trivial and important things alike. Bryan and Jordan screwed up their bodies to be great performers, Marie Curie got cancer to figure out how radioactivity worked, half the great actors and directors in Hollywood were screwed-up shitheels in some way, etc. And yes, my point about Jordan was that he was an asshole, and now he's an asshole with a shitty back and terrible knees. People who are driven to be the greatest are usually pretty different than you or I in some key way. Again, that doesn't make them morons. That's my main point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyuubi Posted August 25, 2016 Share Posted August 25, 2016 4 hours ago, MADCAP said: Well here we go disagreeing for the first time. Im biased in my opinion because I actually love pro wrestling...for the wrestling. So Miz proved he's a company guy. Big deal. I'm sure besides the fact that he loves WWE, he did/does what he does for self-preservation. I'm not a fan because I think his ringwork sucks. Sure he can be led to a passable match occasionally, but let's not get crazy and call him a great worker. For a majority of his career, he's had X-Pac heat. He does have a gift of gab, that's why I said he'd be a great manager. You our broke my heart Burgundy. I appreciate the promo if it builds up to the match and the Miz does that better than anyone today. The issue is when it actually gets to the match itself. It is rarely him that makes the match great by itself. He is a mediocre performer and wrestler and that is good enough, but it is not something I would invest into alone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trocar Slush Weasel Posted August 25, 2016 Share Posted August 25, 2016 9 minutes ago, Smelly McUgly said: And yes, my point about Jordan was that he was an asshole, and now he's an asshole with a shitty back and terrible knees. People who are driven to be the greatest are usually pretty different than you or I in some key way. Again, that doesn't make them morons. That's my main point. Jordan might have shitty knees but that won't stop him from talking to his kids. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Niners Fan in CT Posted August 25, 2016 Share Posted August 25, 2016 This whole thing reminds me of two people, someone who goes to college, obtains their degree goes off to land a nice position at a company and someone who goes and works construction after high school and works their way up the ladder there. Both end up being successful at what they do. Both took different paths. One thinks the other doesn't like to get his hands dirty and is in a way "soft". The other thinks this person is an idiot for working outside all day in the hot sun while he sits in a cool office building. The guy who works outside seems to enjoy working outside and likes not paying student loans. It's just two different paths and neither is going to agree with the other. 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnnyJ Posted August 25, 2016 Share Posted August 25, 2016 I don't even understand half the arguments in this thread. Wrestling is a dangerous physically demanding sport. Was Bryan reckless with his health? Obviously. Has most of the roster, including the Miz been reckless as well? More than likely. Miz has been working a full time WWE schedule for a decade and by my math been in over a thousand matches. Concussions in wrestling are common and I'm sure Miz has had his share. I'm sure Miz has wrestled hurt when a dr would've taken him off the road. He's not a poster child for health and quality of life. He's just a guy who throws weak looking punches in a day and age where wrestlers take unnecessary risks and work snug. Great promo though. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyuubi Posted August 25, 2016 Share Posted August 25, 2016 9 hours ago, Smelly McUgly said: Exactly. There's a wide gulf between "headbutting a ringpost" and "Miz." If it were up to me, there would be far, far, FAR fewer dives and quite a lot more matches based around destroying a limb, which would have the benefit of being both relatively safe and entertaining. I never liked the idea of dives at all unless you are landing on your feet and rolling like a traceur. And I am going top leave this debate alone. If the Miz gets hurt doing the safest shit, I seriously hope this does not bite him in the ass. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nice Guy Eddie Posted August 25, 2016 Share Posted August 25, 2016 1 hour ago, MADCAP said: This is all I see when I see the Miz: The best part of this clip was Cky's "96 Quite Bitter Beings" being played. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wyld Samurai Posted August 25, 2016 Share Posted August 25, 2016 22 minutes ago, JohnnyJ said: I don't even understand half the arguments in this thread. Wrestling is a dangerous physically demanding sport. Was Bryan reckless with his health? Obviously. Has most of the roster, including the Miz been reckless as well? More than likely. Miz has been working a full time WWE schedule for a decade and by my math been in over a thousand matches. Concussions in wrestling are common and I'm sure Miz has had his share. I'm sure Miz has wrestled hurt when a dr would've taken him off the road. He's not a poster child for health and quality of life. He's just a guy who throws weak looking punches in a day and age where wrestlers take unnecessary risks and work snug. Great promo though. You had me until the "snug" part. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RRR Posted August 25, 2016 Share Posted August 25, 2016 I hope this all is a work and DB makes a champion versus champion match at the upcoming Clash. IC champ versus NXT champ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caley Posted August 25, 2016 Share Posted August 25, 2016 Not to derail all this talk about The Miz, but am I the only one who thinks the new interviewer woman sounds like Fran Drescher? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(BP) Posted August 25, 2016 Share Posted August 25, 2016 26 minutes ago, caley said: Not to derail all this talk about The Miz, but am I the only one who thinks the new interviewer woman sounds like Fran Drescher? I thought she sounds like that automaton voice that recaps stuff in clickbait YouTube videos. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bink_winkleman Posted August 25, 2016 Share Posted August 25, 2016 Damn, I saw that Miz promo on FB after it happened and just watched Smackdown tonight. So I was kinda bummed to walk in on eleven pages of the worked shoot thing that was yesterday's news to me and almost no marking out for Slater/Rhyno. Slyno? Gore Gator? Do we get some combination of a spinning ddt and a spear called "the above ground pool?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlie M. Posted August 25, 2016 Share Posted August 25, 2016 12 minutes ago, bink_winkleman said: Damn, I saw that Miz promo on FB after it happened and just watched Smackdown tonight. So I was kinda bummed to walk in on eleven pages of the worked shoot thing that was yesterday's news to me and almost no marking out for Slater/Rhyno. Slyno? Gore Gator? Do we get some combination of a spinning ddt and a spear called "the above ground pool?" Rhyno is going to beat him up because everyone is unusually mean to a poor guy who just wants to keep the job he somehow lost during a draft. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sammo~! Posted August 25, 2016 Share Posted August 25, 2016 I hoe this is all leading to a Heath Slater intergalactic title run. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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