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Elsalvajeloco

UFC 202: Diaz vs. McGregor II (8/20/2016) - Las Vegas, NV (T-Mobile Arena)

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According to Dana on TMZ Sports, someone was injured yesterday and is planning to file a lawsuit.

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On 8/17/2016 at 1:32 PM, Elsalvajeloco said:

To be fair, it's also the more responsible Diaz brother. Nate IIRC has never missed a presser or been late for one.

To call Nate Diaz the more responsible one is faint praise at best.  He has shirked out on press conference and media calls in the past. Not to mention that time he missed weight for the Dos Anjos fight.  Fined for making homophobic remarks on Twitter.  Fined for violating Reebok's outfitting policy.  

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11 minutes ago, TheVileOne said:

To call Nate Diaz the more responsible one is faint praise at best.  He has shirked out on press conference and media calls in the past. Not to mention that time he missed weight for the Dos Anjos fight.  Fined for making homophobic remarks on Twitter.  Fined for violating Reebok's outfitting policy.  

Well, if you think about, Nate also has several more chances to fuck up. Nick is averaging what? 1 fight every 1 and 3/4 years? When he does fight, something eventful happens every time. There are several UFC fights where Nate does nothing relatively wrong. He may have a funny comment or interview, but he doesn't have the high percentage of fuckery as Nick does. Not even close.

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3 hours ago, TheVileOne said:

To call Nate Diaz the more responsible one is faint praise at best.  He has shirked out on press conference and media calls in the past. Not to mention that time he missed weight for the Dos Anjos fight.  Fined for making homophobic remarks on Twitter.  Fined for violating Reebok's outfitting policy.  

Nate missed weight for the Dos Anjos fight, because he had a knee injury and couldn't really do cardio.  He really shouldn't have been fighting.  Nate is a crazy person who says and does outrageous things, but he isn't nearly the unprofessional ass hat his brother is.

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These embedded videos are pulling in great numbers. Is that a good sign? I know the Badd Blood special(before the press conference fight) and Evolution of Punk specials did terrible tv numbers.

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32 minutes ago, Shawn411 said:

These embedded videos are pulling in great numbers. Is that a good sign? I know the Badd Blood special(before the press conference fight) and Evolution of Punk specials did terrible tv numbers.

The McGregor Embedded episodes always do a good numbers as far as I can remember. I wouldn't expect the shoulder programming to do that great going against the Olympics in primetime. 

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McGregor looks like he's cracking up. The only chance I give him in this fight, fighting potentially a full 25 lbs heavier than when he fought Aldo less than a year ago, is if Diaz goes easy in search of the immense payout that the trilogy fight would bring.

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I don't think so either -- so I'm backing Nate heavily. At this point, I meant that's the only way I see McGregor being competitive here. Ground game aside / jiu jitsu aside - McGregor was so heavily rocked by Diaz's punches in the first fight as soon as Nate got into his flow, I don't see how this is going to get any better for him with Nate on a full camp.

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I am not sure how I feel about the whole full camp thing five and a half months after the fact, but that kinda seems overrated in my mind when it comes to Nate. I think that may be more of the way he tends to fight. He was saving his energy....by getting punched in the face repeatedly? Sometimes, it takes Nate time to get going and that's how I feel the McGregor fight went down. He started slowly against Michael Johnson, and that was a full camp if I remember correctly. Yeah, he might come out gangbusters against an old, shot Gray Maynard but how many recent Nate Diaz fights do we see where he is getting in someone's ass immediately? If he has done that, it has been against fighters who overall don't have much for him.

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42 minutes ago, Elsalvajeloco said:

I am not sure how I feel about the whole full camp thing five and a half months after the fact, but that kinda seems overrated in my mind when it comes to Nate. I think that may be more of the way he tends to fight. He was saving his energy....by getting punched in the face repeatedly? Sometimes, it takes Nate time to get going and that's how I feel the McGregor fight went down. He started slowly against Michael Johnson, and that was a full camp if I remember correctly. Yeah, he might come out gangbusters against an old, shot Gray Maynard but how many recent Nate Diaz fights do we see where he is getting in someone's ass immediately? If he has done that, it has been against fighters who overall don't have much for him.

 

Good analysis -- although physically Johnson was a different prospect to McGregor. I still can't get over McGregor going up by over 10 kg in less than 10 months. Wonder what that does to his timing, movement etc. Different sport, but for perspective Pacquiao went up around 15 kg between becoming flyweight champion in '98 to welterweight in '09 in what was a historic career -- McGregor's at 10 kg in less than a year.

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49 minutes ago, Elsalvajeloco said:

I am not sure how I feel about the whole full camp thing five and a half months after the fact, but that kinda seems overrated in my mind when it comes to Nate. I think that may be more of the way he tends to fight. He was saving his energy....by getting punched in the face repeatedly? Sometimes, it takes Nate time to get going and that's how I feel the McGregor fight went down. He started slowly against Michael Johnson, and that was a full camp if I remember correctly. Yeah, he might come out gangbusters against an old, shot Gray Maynard but how many recent Nate Diaz fights do we see where he is getting in someone's ass immediately? If he has done that, it has been against fighters who overall don't have much for him.

Nate is secretly one of the smartest fighters in the entire sport.  He is someone who notices everything his opponent does, figures out how to counter it, and destroys his opponents once he figures them out.  The fights that he has lost are because his opponents are keeping him off balance with leg kicks, which for some reason he doesn't like to check, and/or takedowns.  Standing and trading punches with Nate Diaz generally leads to Nate delivering an ass whooping.  The thing that really puts him ahead for me is that McGregor is kind of tailor made for Nate Diaz' fight style.  McGregor has to either knock Diaz out quickly, fight like an entirely different person, or fight the fight of his life.  Nate Diaz can just be Nate Diaz. 

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For me...I am not sure if Conor has to completely fight like a different person. Does he have make changes? Sure, I think that is clearly evident. However, when you bloody up someone to the degree of what Conor did, there is definitely an element of success there. However, as I asserted yesterday, you have to find the right mix of that. Breen brought on the Sherdog roundtable that Conor forgot all about the leg kicks. That's another key element. So I would say he would have to fight a much smarter and calculated fight to win rather than an entirely different fight. Just because you got submitted doesn't mean you throw the entirety of what you did right in the garbage. You assess what you did right and wrong and go from there.

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3 minutes ago, Elsalvajeloco said:

For me...I am not sure if Conor has to completely fight like a different person. Does he have make changes? Sure, I think that is clearly evident. However, when you bloody up someone to the degree of what Conor did, there is definitely an element of success there. However, as I asserted yesterday, you have to find the right mix of that. Breen brought on the Sherdog roundtable that Conor forgot all about the leg kicks. That's another key element. So I would say he would have to fight a much smarter and calculated fight to win rather than an entirely different fight. Just because you got submitted doesn't mean you throw the entirety of what you did right in the garbage. You assess what you did right and wrong and go from there.

The thing that became really apparent in their first fight was that McGregor had no idea how to land on Diaz without lunging in.  Until that fight he was always the bigger fighter, and had no idea how to deal with fighting a taller fighter.  McGregor landed a few good punches in that first fight, but Diaz slipped a lot of punches.  Conor's biggest problem is that he couldn't really throw combinations, because Nate's ability to control the distance.  He'd leap in throw a punch and have to reset.  That is what tired him out, he couldn't set his feet and throw efficiently.  Conor eventually had to stand in front of Diaz and try to counter him which Diaz figured out in no time at all.  Once Diaz felt like he knew where Conor's counters were coming from he doubled his punching output and Conor had no answers.  Conor would have to hurt Diaz and hurt him early for this fight to go differently in my eyes.  What makes Conor great is his timing, his punching power, and his athleticism.  He is a guy who can hit most of his opponents, because he is longer and faster than them.  They have to step into his striking range if they want any chance to land any strikes at all, and he is great at punishing them before they can get to him.  He can't do that with Diaz.    Diaz has a better understanding of the fundamentals of footwork, head movement, and how to control distance.  Diaz also has a chin of granite and a shit load of high level experience in tough fights.  Diaz isn't going to panic, he's most likely going to be able to withstand the smaller McGregor's power, and once he figures out his strategy I think he pours it on him again.

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Take for what it's worth, but Dana White told TMZ that someone is going to file a lawsuit against Diaz and McGregor because they were "injured" their their bottle throwing.

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19 minutes ago, supremebve said:

The thing that became really apparent in their first fight was that McGregor had no idea how to land on Diaz without lunging in.  Until that fight he was always the bigger fighter, and had no idea how to deal with fighting a taller fighter.  McGregor landed a few good punches in that first fight, but Diaz slipped a lot of punches.  Conor's biggest problem is that he couldn't really throw combinations, because Nate's ability to control the distance.  He'd leap in throw a punch and have to reset.  That is what tired him out, he couldn't set his feet and throw efficiently.  Conor eventually had to stand in front of Diaz and try to counter him which Diaz figured out in no time at all.  Once Diaz felt like he knew where Conor's counters were coming from he doubled his punching output and Conor had no answers.  Conor would have to hurt Diaz and hurt him early for this fight to go differently in my eyes.  What makes Conor great is his timing, his punching power, and his athleticism.  He is a guy who can hit most of his opponents, because he is longer and faster than them.  They have to step into his striking range if they want any chance to land any strikes at all, and he is great at punishing them before they can get to him.  He can't do that with Diaz.    Diaz has a better understanding of the fundamentals of footwork, head movement, and how to control distance.  Diaz also has a chin of granite and a shit load of high level experience in tough fights.  Diaz isn't going to panic, he's most likely going to be able to withstand the smaller McGregor's power, and once he figures out his strategy I think he pours it on him again.

That's why it is so important for McGregor to mix it up and disrupt Nate's rhythm. In the past, Nate hasn't done well in those fights where it's one part kickboxing, one part wrestling match, one part boxing, and one part defending from his back. Nate's boxing is underrated in that as a taller fighter, he can reach over your punches to land his. Also, part of defense is not running into that returning volley. A lot of time, he is able to back them off anyway. However, very few times do you see him get clobbered by a countershot. You see this a lot with heavyweights where dudes dip their heads in while throwing and get absolutely leveled. Even if you do land those shots against Nate, he is standing at a sufficient enough distance where those shots don't have a lot of power. Against someone like a Dennis Siver or Diego Brandao, Conor was close enough to hug those dudes by time he was sprinting in land strikes. That's a lot less ground to cover. You can't have a semi-phone booth boxing match with a much better boxer and standing at a reach disadvantage.

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4 minutes ago, Elsalvajeloco said:

That's why it is so important for McGregor to mix it up and disrupt Nate's rhythm. In the past, Nate hasn't done well in those fights where it's one part kickboxing, one part wrestling match, one part boxing, and one part defending from his back. Nate's boxing is underrated in that as a taller fighter, he can reach over your punches to land his. Also, part of defense is not running into that returning volley. A lot of time, he is able to back them off anyway. However, very few times do you see him get clobbered by a countershot. You see this a lot with heavyweights where dudes dip their heads in while throwing and get absolutely leveled. Even if you do land those shots against Nate, he is standing at a sufficient enough distance where those shots don't have a lot of power. Against someone like a Dennis Siver or Diego Brandao, Conor was close enough to hug those dudes by time he was sprinting in land strikes. That's a lot less ground to cover. You can't have a semi-phone booth boxing match with a much better boxer and standing at a reach disadvantage.

I just rewatched the fight (3rd time this week) and Conor missed 90-95% of the second punches in a combination.  Diaz' boxing is outrageously good.  By boxing, I'm not even talking about punching, I'm talking about how he is never in the same place twice.  If you land a counter left over his jab, he is not going to be there the next time he throws that punch.  He moves his feet after every punch, moves his head up, down, left, right, forward, and backwards to evade punches.  He uses his footwork and head movement in concert so his head can be more than a foot away without actually moving his body more than a couple inches.  A slight pivot to either side and shifting his weight from his from his front leg to his back leg takes him no energy, but the huge whiffing right hook saps his opponent's energy.  He also knows exactly when to turn up the heat.  The turning point of the fight was when McGregor landed a big uppercut and Diaz realized, "wait a minute, his power is gone."  Diaz then stopped playing defense and just battered him. 

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1 hour ago, TheVileOne said:

Take for what it's worth, but Dana White told TMZ that someone is going to file a lawsuit against Diaz and McGregor because they were "injured" their their bottle throwing.

Giving some jabroni a small payoff is no problem when compared with how much the press conference will add to business.

That's if there is any merit to the injury.

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1 hour ago, We Dem Boyz said:

Giving some jabroni a small payoff is no problem when compared with how much the press conference will add to business.

That's if there is any merit to the injury.

 

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