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NXT TakeOver: The End


The Natural

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There's been a noticeable trend of people on this board hating any crowd that chants stuff or doesn't go along with what the company wants the crowd to do. A lot of people see it purely as the crowd trying to get themselves over (which is the dumbest fucking idea) instead of the crowd actually getting into the show and getting behind people they actually like. Case in point, the comment above me. "Sense of entitlement", "act too smart". It's 2016, this is how wrestling crowds act. If you don't like that, go to an indie show in Alabama or whatever where the members of the audience just pull weapons out on the talent. Gotta think some people probably enjoy that, since it takes them back to the "good ol' days of 'rasslin" or something.

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The Full Sail Crowd isn't any different than the ECW crowd... or any crowd where it's the same people at all the shows. It's natural when you develop a local following that they develop their own traits and smarmy "in crowd" behavior. 

I do give the Full Sail Crowd credit for keeping the "you f@#^Ed up" to a minimum... especially considering all the green talent they see.

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23 minutes ago, Casey said:

There's been a noticeable trend of people on this board hating any crowd that chants stuff or doesn't go along with what the company wants the crowd to do.

Let's not confuse a crowd rejecting Roman Reigns or supporting Daniel Bryan with a crowd that loves the smell of its own farts - faux-clever "Who Are You" chants aren't a part of some righteous crusade.

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46 minutes ago, Casey said:

There's been a noticeable trend of people on this board hating any crowd that chants stuff or doesn't go along with what the company wants the crowd to do. A lot of people see it purely as the crowd trying to get themselves over (which is the dumbest fucking idea) instead of the crowd actually getting into the show and getting behind people they actually like. Case in point, the comment above me. "Sense of entitlement", "act too smart". It's 2016, this is how wrestling crowds act. If you don't like that, go to an indie show in Alabama or whatever where the members of the audience just pull weapons out on the talent. Gotta think some people probably enjoy that, since it takes them back to the "good ol' days of 'rasslin" or something.

You're probably onto something with it being an offshoot of the "wrestling isn't like it was when I was a kid anymore" mindset. Even if you hate the dueling chants and "this is awesome" style chants that have been a part of wrestling for over 10 years now, the Full Sail crowd really isn't overtly obnoxious in that context either. They probably stick to company-approved face/heel lines better than any crowd in North America.

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1 hour ago, Wyld Samurai said:

I look at the Full Sail Crowd as having a sense of entitlement to the point that they act too smart for their own good. 

You can't fault then for that as they're seeing the same people grow and work through their mistakes so they take a different stance to some wrestlers... much like the old ECW crowd.

...Y'all do realize that it is the Orlando hipster crowd that goes to these matches right?

I went to UCF and I knew how to act because I used to go to those old FCW matches in Tampa. The Fullsail crowd are mostly college students or people in their mid to late 20s. 

They are assholes by default.

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And yet it was those same assholes reacting the way they do that gave us insanly over goofs like Chad Gable and Tye Dillinger.

That shit would be dead in a month if they debuted like that on the main roster.

Now they have history, they have credibility. All because those assholes went all in on "TEN!" and "Ready, Willing and Gable."

I love them singing along to Nak's theme. Just like I loved them singing along to Zayn's. Just like I love them singing through every match. It makes me stop thinking so damn critically about things and I fall into cheering/booing again.

Without that crowd NXT wouldnt be what it is.

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I saw tons of people whining about the crowd during Nakamura/Aries, and I personally don't get it. It's one thing if it's, say, a post Wrestlemania crowd chanting "We are Awesome" ignoring what's going in the ring. The theme music chant was just really cool and, really, just felt like a pure joy over Nak being there type of deal.

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3 hours ago, Cristobal said:

What does "get themselves over" even mean in the context of a wrestling crowd? Like if they come up with a clever enough chant, Hunter's going to put them on the writing staff?

More matches with Blue Pants cause Trips still can't figure that one out. 

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I find the judging of fans and how they enjoy a show to be silly. I don't like a dead crowd at all but if a loud raucous crowd starts a goofy chat and they are enjoying themselves, so be it.

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11 hours ago, Cristobal said:

What does "get themselves over" even mean in the context of a wrestling crowd? Like if they come up with a clever enough chant, Hunter's going to put them on the writing staff?

I'll admit that it may seem a bit pearl clutching on my part, but I am one of the more outspoken critics of modern wrestling crowds, so I guess I'll try and address what I mean when I've said "sense of entitlement". I don't care about crowds having fun at a wrestling show, or booing the face and cheering the heel. It's 2016. We all know it's fake, like who you like. I think the danger is that crowds like Full Sail have come to believe that by chanting for some and booing some others, they can decide who gets pushed, who should be champion. Wrestling is 100% narrative driven. It's a story based around bad vs. good, and moral comeuppance. Sometimes those stories fail, lord knows they have often in the past decade or so. That being said, I don't think it's the place of the crowd to actively try and undermine a narrative just because their favorite should be more heavily featured. The stories that are being told can never improve, because everyone reacts so in the moment and so viscerally that it becomes impossible to truly learn and understand where things went wrong and subsequently how to fix them. I guess I'm not necessarily asking for crowds to stop chanting for goofy shit, I'm asking them to exercise a bit of patience, both on a micro and macro scale. Don't start chanting the moment a control segment starts. Don't shit on a storyline in week one of a PPV build because you think it might lead to your new favorite getting BURIED~!. 

Smart crowds are great, because they hold wrestlers and writers to a higher standard than ever before. They just need to realize that there has to be a middle ground between what they want and what is on the screen.   

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I might be in the minority on the cage match, but I thought it was better than it's gotten credit for being so far. Of course, the fact that I watched the show in pieces probably plays into that. 

The reason, though, is in the post-blood era, no one has cracked the code as far as having a great cage match in WWE. But I think so far Joe and Balor have come the closest. And yes, there were a lot of setup spots but they were also, if not completely original still creative. 

Put it this way: I would watch that match again before I watch Bret-Owen again.

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On 6/10/2016 at 7:33 PM, L_W_P said:

And yet it was those same assholes reacting the way they do that gave us insanly over goofs like Chad Gable and Tye Dillinger.

That shit would be dead in a month if they debuted like that on the main roster.

Now they have history, they have credibility. All because those assholes went all in on "TEN!" and "Ready, Willing and Gable.".

This is crazy talk. The way the crowd reacts (that is the manner that annoys many folks, not the positive reaction) will have no impact on whether the Full Sail favorites get over on the main roster. 

sheesh,

RAF

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I feel like there is a pretty big difference between chanting in reaction to something and chanting to amuse yourself. People try to start all sorts of weird, funny chants all the time at shows but the vast majority of them aren't picked up by the rest of the crowd. A lot of times it's just someone trying to have a laugh or get a laugh from the people around them.

I think most chants and reactions are trained now. There's just a script for how to react at a wrestling show. This isn't to say the reactions aren't genuine, but "THIS IS AWESOME," "HOLY SHIT," etc., aren't entirely organic either. I think it's weird that so many of you would take offense to people being tired of that script or the specific scripts that develop in Full Sail.

I also think it's weird not to acknowledge that a lot of crowds try really hard to be cute or clever for their own amusement. I'm not making an argument about how that attitude relates to what people think about what's happening in the ring, but to ignore that most chants start as something a person WANTS other folks to chant (because they think it'd be funny) seems ignorant. 

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The Full Sail crowd simply won't shut the fuck up. I don't mean cheering or booing, but it seems like they'll quit breathing if they quit chanting or quit singing someone's theme song or God knows what .They're totally in love with the sound of their own voices and need to learn to sit back and just watch the damn wrestling sometimes instead of thinking of something clever to sing.

Oh yeah: Nak-Aries: A lot like Nakamura-Styles at Wrestle Kingdom - do a bunch of meaningless stuff until time to flip the switch at the end. It was still a great match, just not as good as the main, and nowhere near Nakamura-Zayn. The main got really good at the end and was smartly worked throughout.

 

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Hind sight being what it is, I'll take this crowd over the London one.

At the very least, the Fullsail chants are a reaction to something.

EDIT: Oh, and they didn't start the ref off-counting, thanks London. For the most part, they will shout down the more dumber chants.

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2 hours ago, jstout said:

The Full Sail crowd simply won't shut the fuck up. I don't mean cheering or booing, but it seems like they'll quit breathing if they quit chanting or quit singing someone's theme song or God knows what .They're totally in love with the sound of their own voices and need to learn to sit back and just watch the damn wrestling sometimes instead of thinking of something clever to sing.

Oh yeah: Nak-Aries: A lot like Nakamura-Styles at Wrestle Kingdom - do a bunch of meaningless stuff until time to flip the switch at the end. It was still a great match, just not as good as the main, and nowhere near Nakamura-Zayn. The main got really good at the end and was smartly worked throughout.

 

 

The ring announcer basically begs people to chant all night long and actually gets mad if people are quiet for a long period of time. Especially with the "NXT" chant.

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Well it is basically a studio audience more than a theater/arena. The people running the NXT shows are being groomed for production in television so they have to coach audiences when to cheer and stuff. Didn't the WWE start using prompt's for people to cheer at Wrestlemania (like on the Jerry Tron there was a thing for New Day during the match for people to do a chant).

I wouldn't be surprised if on those little screens above the ring they have the words to the Bayley chants spelled out and have go beat by beat for people.

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Wow, we've actually gotten to the point where people are unironically advocating for dead crowds.

Spoiler

Next post:

"I didn't say I wanted crowds to be dead, I just want them to react at the exact times and with the exact intensity that I, a true fan, would in their situation."

 

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To me, that shows their level of interest and investment in a product or talent. When they're singing that song to Bayley, for example - it's about the crowd absolutely LOVING her and hand-picking her as their girl. Some see it the way I do, others see it like you do - annoying and pointless. The most fun shows, for me, are NXT specials (especially when they're held outside of Florida) or the RAW after WrestleMania. I don't see it as the crowd trying to amuse themselves (unless it's a Sheamus and/or Orton match).

And to whoever said the crowd needs to learn a middle ground because they can't pick who gets pushed, or whatever - that's absolute horseshit and something that's entrenched in old school wrestling. The crowd absolutely can pick who gets over and therefore gets a push, we're only just now starting to see the extent to which that can happen. They might have a storyline or wrestler in mind for something big, but as we've seen with Reigns, if the crowd doesn't want it or like it, it's going to fail. Logical thing would be for the company to turn around and, y'know, do what their consumers want. Most other pro wrestling organizations would do that.

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I think my favorite spot of the night was in the cage match with Balor on the top rope kicking the crap out of Joe's chin, and then Joe falling and causing Balor to lose his balance and crotch himself on the top rope. 

Really enjoyed the hell out of the tag and Aries / Nakamura.  I haven't been a fan of Aries for a long time, but his desperate flurries of offense remind me a lot of Daniel Bryan (in a charisma-less fashion, if that makes sense).  Nakamura is Nakamura.  He's an anime character realized.  Nakamura has that innate ability (like Brock) to make a pre-scripted pantomime seem like a real fight. 

 

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I'd much rather have Full Sail-style crowds that actually give a shit about what's happening in the ring, no matter their reasons, than your typical RAW crowd, which I've said before.

I will say that the mark of a great NXT match is that it causes the crowd to cut the chanting and just start cheering or reacting in more immediate and (seemingly) organic ways. For example, for Bayley/Sasha Ironman, the crowd started with a self-important "WOMEN'S WRESTLING" chant and then, by the time Sasha put in work on Bayley about fourteen minutes in and made Izzy cry, they were legit booing like a typical heated crowd. Even their chants (the questionable "Sasha's ratchet" chant, specifically) were meant to actually show their displeasure with the wrestler they were chanting at ala your typical chants from an '80s Southern wrestling crowd like "WE DON'T WANNA HEAR IT!"

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I'm fine with all the chanting and general antics of the NXT crowd but the singing/whatever just ruins matches. 

Yes a dead Raw crowd sucks and if they hummed dolph zigglers theme through his 1000th match with Sheamus I would love it but for Aries/Nakamura it sucked. 

 

 

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