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Star Wars: The Force Awakens Reactions - SPOILERS HERE ONLY

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All this Phasma stuff, they were saying like a year ago she was just going to be a minor character who gets a bigger role in later films.

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My buddy and I wanted more Wookie Rage after Han died. We also thought Phasma was wasted. They always said Chewie could tear people apart. I think Han dying would have been  the perfect time for Chewie to rip a Stormtrooper or two apart. 

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On a sheer scoreboard level, Chewie was able to get a hit on the unhittable guy because of that, and that was the hit that let Rey fight him later on. So, yeah. It wasn't insubstantial. I agree on some level. 

 

If I had a problem with anything in the movie, it was the scale of time. Everything seemed rushed, not in how the movie was paced, but in how it seemed to relate to a larger world. I get there's a sense of that in Star Wars, but you also had the sense that things took more time, in that they spent a few weeks preparing for the attack on the Death Star and everyone got to know Luke better, etc. You don't get the sense that people would really know Finn in the same way. 

 

That's probably a bit of a nitpick. The idea that Leia was putting her resources into finding Luke instead of researching the giant starkiller the bad guys had though? That seemed sort of weird in retrospect. Understandable as it was tied into her son but maybe not admirable. I like that the military wing and Ren had different priorities though, just like Vader and Tarkin.

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I loved it.

But my one complaint that really goes all the way back to Jedi and Leia being Luke's sister: When everyone important know each other or are related it makes this vast galaxy tiny. Rey is probably Luke's daughter, but I really hope not.

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I really could have used another 10 minutes between the big battle and finding Luke. A few scenes of her taking off while somewhat explaining why no one else in the resistance decided to go find Luke would have been great. I need an extended edition blue ray RIGHT NOW!

That's my only gripe. Loved it. Poe was cool and all, but Finn is going to be the classic character when it's all said and done. I'm about 90% sure he ends up with the Falcon. I thought his scenes were the absolute best.

The plot was a little too much like IV, but the character development was handled in a completely new and fresh way. The way Rey discovers her powers on her own instead of being shown was slick. Finn gaining courage was cool. Loved loved Ren having a childish streak that will surely be worked out of him. Having a villain who actually matures and changes throughout the series is a fairly original thing as far as blockbusters go.

Sooo many more thoughts to come.

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One thing about Ren being the villain is how small he is in stature compared to Vader. Vader was a MONSTER. Ren looks evil. He does evil shit... but he can never be Vader. Vader scared mother fuckers by size alone. I love the idea he is trying to project monster but is a scrawny asshole. 

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I'm used to retcons, but I'm not used to retcons that change something that was true my entire life, really, something that was part of the truth that shaped the ethos of my youth. I'm still getting used to the idea that the victory in Jedi really didn't mean all that much. I'm okay with it and think on some level it was the right decision because I've seen dozens of wishy washy attempts like this that failed and this was a success because it was so brazen, but it's still something to get used to. It's no big deal but it left me feeling far more wistful than Han dying, for instance.

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I'm used to retcons, but I'm not used to retcons that change something that was true my entire life, really, something that was part of the truth that shaped the ethos of my youth. I'm still getting used to the idea that the victory in Jedi really didn't mean all that much. I'm okay with it and think on some level it was the right decision because I've seen dozens of wishy washy attempts like this that failed and this was a success because it was so brazen, but it's still something to get used to.

It wasn't bad per se, but it was really weird the lengths they went to basically reset all the pieces back to their original positions. Han and Chewie are back to smuggling. Leia is back to leading a rebel, er, resistance force against the space nazis.. Luke is once again isolated on a backwater planet. We spent 30 years wondering what happened next to these characters, and it turns out the answer was, "Eh, you know, pretty much the same stuff."

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I think you are unwilling to accept that new evils and threats spring up even after victory. Not every empire or republic gets a Pax Romana or Pax Mongolica. This isn't unique to Star Wars. It's human history as well. 

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Hey, the New Republic lasted longer than The Empire.

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I'm used to retcons, but I'm not used to retcons that change something that was true my entire life, really, something that was part of the truth that shaped the ethos of my youth. I'm still getting used to the idea that the victory in Jedi really didn't mean all that much. I'm okay with it and think on some level it was the right decision because I've seen dozens of wishy washy attempts like this that failed and this was a success because it was so brazen, but it's still something to get used to.

It wasn't bad per se, but it was really weird the lengths they went to basically reset all the pieces back to their original positions. Han and Chewie are back to smuggling. Leia is back to leading a rebel, er, resistance force against the space nazis.. Luke is once again isolated on a backwater planet. We spent 30 years wondering what happened next to these characters, and it turns out the answer was, "Eh, you know, pretty much the same stuff."

 

 

I was responding to Matt but I can add to this as well. Typically, when you fail or don't achieve, you go back to what you are comfortable with. If Leia and Han's son chooses the Dark Side, it makes sense it would splinter their relationship and they would go back to doing what they know best. If Luke feels he is responsible for Ren going dark, it makes sense he would want to avoid people and risk being a failure as a Jedi Master. I have no problem with the resets at all because it is exactly what you would expect people to do. 

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I'm used to retcons, but I'm not used to retcons that change something that was true my entire life, really, something that was part of the truth that shaped the ethos of my youth. I'm still getting used to the idea that the victory in Jedi really didn't mean all that much. I'm okay with it and think on some level it was the right decision because I've seen dozens of wishy washy attempts like this that failed and this was a success because it was so brazen, but it's still something to get used to.

It wasn't bad per se, but it was really weird the lengths they went to basically reset all the pieces back to their original positions. Han and Chewie are back to smuggling. Leia is back to leading a rebel, er, resistance force against the space nazis.. Luke is once again isolated on a backwater planet. We spent 30 years wondering what happened next to these characters, and it turns out the answer was, "Eh, you know, pretty much the same stuff."

 

A friend said that it was great they showed just a little bit and now he wants to know what happened in the middle! 

 

The answer is "not much." That's what I got. 

 

Luke tried to start a new Jedi order. His nephew got corrupted, went to the dark side. He Obi-Wan'd his way into hiding. 

Han was pissed off that Leia sent him to Luke and either before or after that backfired, he left, and ended up as a smuggler again, not even with the Falcon, as the world slowly passed him by.

Leia lost the peace pretty severely, to the point where she was spending her best resources on finding a Luke that didn't want to be found instead of researching the new starkiller and thus any gains they actually made over DECADES (and they weren't all that impressive to begin with apparently) were lost just like that.

 

 

I think you are unwilling to accept that new evils and threats spring up even after victory. Not every empire or republic gets a Pax Romana or Pax Mongolica. This isn't unique to Star Wars. It's human history as well. 

 

Of course that's fair, Will. Not to bring party politics into it but look at the state of "Hope" eight years later after that victory. Even Rome fell and before that it went from being a republic to being something far more autocratic. 

 

But Star Wars isn't about human history. It's one of the most powerful new myths of our lifetimes. Lucas himself chipped away at it with the prequels by showing the Republic as corrupt and the Confederacy having a point and having the Jedi Order be backwards and complacent and embarrassing when it came to things like the whole "will balance the force" prophecy, but that was just the way you GOT to Jedi.

 

It makes everything more human and grounded and in some ways that's good, it's great. In others, it's the only way this will work as a potent, powerful force, and not just reliving the ghosts of the past. 

 

But I think it's a distinct change from what Star Wars was to what it now is. I don't think that genie can go back into the bottle.

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I'm used to retcons, but I'm not used to retcons that change something that was true my entire life, really, something that was part of the truth that shaped the ethos of my youth. I'm still getting used to the idea that the victory in Jedi really didn't mean all that much. I'm okay with it and think on some level it was the right decision because I've seen dozens of wishy washy attempts like this that failed and this was a success because it was so brazen, but it's still something to get used to.

It wasn't bad per se, but it was really weird the lengths they went to basically reset all the pieces back to their original positions. Han and Chewie are back to smuggling. Leia is back to leading a rebel, er, resistance force against the space nazis.. Luke is once again isolated on a backwater planet. We spent 30 years wondering what happened next to these characters, and it turns out the answer was, "Eh, you know, pretty much the same stuff."

 

I was responding to Matt but I can add to this as well. Typically, when you fail or don't achieve, you go back to what you are comfortable with. If Leia and Han's son chooses the Dark Side, it makes sense it would splinter their relationship and they would go back to doing what they know best. If Luke feels he is responsible for Ren going dark, it makes sense he would want to avoid people and risk being a failure as a Jedi Master. I have no problem with the resets at all because it is exactly what you would expect people to do.

"Exactly what you would expect people to do" does not generally make for good drama.

Which was not even really my point, because it was pretty good drama.

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I've seen a lot of people question why Ren wasn't fully trained by Snoke but isn't it obvious?  He's tempted by the light. Snoke wanted to make sure Ren was THE guy, he even stated that..  Ren says something like "I'll finish what I started" or something and Snoke says "we'll see"

 

So now that Ren bossed up and got rid of his father, Snoke is willing to properly train him.

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It's worth keeping in mind, on that point, that the Emperor was always somewhat careful with Vader until his fiery maiming, at which point most of his power was then devoted to keeping his body alive, etc. etc. 

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I'll say one more thing about the tone of the the"reset". More than a plot line, it was a symbolic reset from the disaster of the prequels. It was a reminder that Han is a smuggler, Leia is a resistance leader and the old last Jedi is bound to be a hermit. Everything that is old is new again and they did an awesome job of getting us to that point. For Episode 8, with the exception of Luke, I am looking forward to what the new leads are going to do, not the old ones. For Episode 7, I wanted to see the old guys. That's a huge, huge accomplishment. 

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It's also worth noting that the movie revealed basically nothing about Snoke. It's entirely possible he's not an all-knowing Sith lord who took on Ben Solo as his apprentice, like everyone assumes. His underdeveloped skills could have as much to do with his teacher not being the real deal as anything else.

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Also, Finn is totally the new Han. I see some gripes about how it was a bait and switch with the promotion of the movie (I guess people expected that he was FS etc..) but this will be BETTER for him. The character has a lot of depth.  Just like Han, he manipulates, lies his way through tight situations, would rather not deal with bullshit, but he's also brave and chooses to do the right thing. 

 

He's even got a trademark jacket.  He's Han. He's funny as hell too.  Best character for me.

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They're not going to redo Vader turning on Sideous in the end with Kylo turning on Snoke, right?

 

Man, you just watched them do an almost beat-for-beat remake of ANH and you're going to ask that question?

"It's like poetry, sort of. They rhyme." - George Lucas

There is 100% chance Kylo dies a tragic, redemptive death in Episode 9.

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Yeah I see them setting people up for some big pivot in the next one. I'm predicting a really dope Poe heel turn.

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I just think it's cool that Valdemort and the rest of Slytherin were able to go a long time ago and a galaxy far, far away to start the First Order.

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I felt like this movie was in a lot of places just a remake of ANH. The death star thing is stupid. "its BIGGER" seriously how many death stars get destroyed before they figure out that the entire thing's stability should not hinge on some exposed part. Parts of it were real good. Poe seemed like the best character in that opening scene then he's kind of neutered the rest of the movie. Finn the same way he starts out interesting and slowly becomes bland. Rey and Ren more than held their own. Pretty good maybe a B- or so. Guardians of the Galaxy was a lot better. 

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Finn is the new Han, Rey is the new Luke and Poe is Wedge with an expanded role OR they split Luke in to 2 characters (Finn/Poe) with one of them being Luke being more of the hotshot pilot as opposed ot the Jedi.

That's pretty much how I break it down.

 

James

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Who made a map to Skywalker? And why did R2 sleep on 90% until after the climax? I realize that they might explain it in two lines in the next ep., but the whole plot of the film hinged on it.

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