Star Wars: The Force Awakens Reactions - SPOILERS HERE ONLY

[supremebve]

Poe explained that. He got thrown clear/KO'd, woke up after everything exploded, and made his way back.

Whether she couls take him at 100% is another matter entirely.

 

 

 

How strong is Kylo Ren in the force?  He stopped a blaster bolt in mid air and just held it there while he walked around and had conversations and shit, but he also almost died in a lightsaber fight with someone who seemingly doesn't have any force sensitivity and someone who just figured out she is force sensitive. 

Rey's a quick learner who'd already shown she has an innate level of force-ishness (shut up) capable of countering Ren's own level of foce-ishness (shut up) and training during the attempted mind-reading. Also, wasn't Ren stumbling around at the time with a Chewy-induced leaky gut? 

 

 I remember Poe saying that, but he was in the middle of a desert with the entire First Order looking for him.  Are we supposed to believe that he was able to catch the first spaceship back home with no questions asked?  There has to have been a story about how he got off the planet and back home in time to lead a counterattack on Maz Kanata's planet.  He was the first new character we see on the screen, which probably means he's important in the long run.  They gave us enough information on Finn and Rey for us to ask, "what's next," but as much as I liked the character Poe doesn't have a hook for me to bite. 

 

Kylo Ren seems like a super powerful sith, with crazy powers, but no control.  Rey, who may be even more powerful, seems to have the focus and control but no actual technique.  I'm just skeptical that Rey and Finn, who almost died fighting a regular stormtrooper with that lightsaber, could have held their own with Ren.  I'm using wrestling logic, but they should have put Kylo Ren over huge as an ass kicker early so the payoff would be even bigger when the faces finally go over.  I would have actually liked it better if Rey and Finn would have taken out the general instead of Ren in the first movie.  If the movie ended with Ren killing his father and Rey and Finn taking out the other general before they all leave the planet, don't we feel like both sides are even?  It isn't a huge deal, I just think that both sides could have been put over a little stronger.

 

My favorite part of the movie is that they don't explain everything.  We know enough about Rey and Fin that we have plenty of questions, but not so much that we know where they're going from here.

[LethalStriker]

If Rey was the daughter of Luke then how wouldn't Han know who she was?  She's not that significantly younger then Ben/Kylo is and Luke didn't leave until after failing to train Ben so considering her age if she was Luke's daughter would've been born prior to Luke going into hiding?

[John from Cincinnati]

In all fairness, I think Ren got put over pretty strong. Stopping Poe's shot at the beginning got a audible "oh shit" level reaction from my theater. And it took Chewy-induced injuries and a fight with Finn to get Ren worn down enough that Rey could put him on his ass. And I still don't consider that a decisive victory for Rey. The planet split apart before Ren and Rey could settle it.

 

Then you have Stormtroopers scurrying away from Ren's volatile temper tantrums and that "I killed Han Solo" heat. They put him over pretty strong, IMO. Dude's going to be a monster when his training is complete. 

[Ace]

Amusing cameo news: The Stormtrooper that Rey uses the Jedi Mind Trick on?

 

Daniel Craig,

[Craig H]

Like Jay Z said: Fuck critics, you can kiss my whole asshole.

[EVA]

Given the whole deal about the lightsaber being the Skywalker family lightsaber (rather than Luke's green one) I don't see any way she isn't Luke's daughter.

Casual fan. Not an expert. Didn't bother with a rewatch during the wait for VII. So I honestly need to ask: Has it been established that family ties are the best way to transfer lightsaber ownership from one person to another? Do lightsabers recognize themselves as having an owner like the wands in Harry Potter? Because I remember none of that. I always saw them as silly laser swords wielded most competently by people with a strong connection to the force, thus explaining Finn's comparative lackluster performance against Ren and that Stormtrooper. When Obi-Wan gave Luke the lightsaber in A New Hope, was it implied that it would be especially powerful in Luke's hands because of its connection to Darth? Or was that simply meant to give it sentimental value?

Help a brother out.

Not that I know of. It's more the story the film seemed to be telling with the lightsaber calling to Rey/giving her trippy Force visions/'choosing' her over Ren as well as the speech about how it was Luke's and Luke's father's before him. With so much emphasis on the lineage it just seems to be pointing that way.

Also recall that during Kylo's interrogation of Rey, when he reads her mind, he talks about how after she was stranded on Jakku she imagined herself on an island in the middle of an ocean.

Well, guess where they find Luke. Either that's a crazy, subconscious Force connection or Rey had been there before.

I hope it's the former, but kinda expect it to be the latter.

[Raziel]

Ok, couple things.

 

I dig how Ren is not complete, not only just a petulant child when he's not getting his way, but that he's so easily rattled that he's beatable right now.  We also don't know just who Snoke is or how trained he could be, or how well he could really train Ren.  Now, don't know Rey's background, or who her parents were, but it was pretty established that even on the shithole planet she was stuck on, she was a history junkie and knew the stories (along with having a huge technical aptitude) and had martial ability.  She also had issue using any powers unless she was calm and focused, which the series has established for a while is needed to channel the force.  Vader could force choke people when he was pissy because he was just pissy, but he was also in control and focused.  

 

Rey gave some shit a shot that she had heard the Jedi could do, and put the link of staying calm together.  Reinforced by pulling off the Mind Trick when calm, and that when she focused and rattled Ren, she beat out his reading her mind.  By the time she had the lightsaber fight, Ren was hurt and angry, and she just focused on surviving.  Both big moves she pulled off to reverse that fight happened when she centered herself and focused, and won out because both times Ren was rattled and couldn't do half his stuff.

 

Re The Lightsaber.  Obi-Wan pulling Anakin's lightsaber in III was to skip that step when Luke was ready.  They established (and its confirmed in Clone Wars and Rebels) that building your own lightsaber is still a major training step, but finding one, in this case, twice, skips that step.  The way this story went, the only way to have a lightsaber fight was to MacGuffin a lightsaber into the story, and this one made a bit of sense.  

 

I won't make too much of Ren seeing the island in Rey's mind.  They established in III that sometimes dreams in Force Sensitives are actually visions of the future (all of Anakin's nightmares, Luke's visions of Han and Leia in Cloud City)  She could've been seeing herself on that island for a while and Ren just picked up on it.

 

One of the big plot points was Snoke apparently being scared shitless of Luke getting back in the game, so he wanted to take him out first.  He has to realize now that there's another Force Sensitive in play and Ren killed Han, Luke is coming back into play.  It'll be neat to see where they go from there.

 

I will fully admit I was completly wrong in my assessment that killing Han was a bad choice.  It was pulled off beautifully and done well and fit within the story.  It wasn't done for the sake of being done, it was needed to drive the plot forward.  How this affects the enivitible Episode IX Ren vs. Rey Dark vs. Light Main Event will be interesting, as it was a major event in both characters lives.

 

I got more, but dinner calls.

[EVA]

 

The script really leaned into the whole Joseph Campbell heroic journey/monomyth idea that influenced the original.

More like, the movie is almost a beat-for-beat remake of ANH. The first half, especially. It's like Rob Zombie's STAR WARS.

[odessasteps]

The script really leaned into the whole Joseph Campbell heroic journey/monomyth idea that influenced the original.

More like, the movie is almost a beat-for-beat remake of ANH. The first half, especially. It's like Rob Zombie's STAR WARS.

Does that mean it also ripped off Hidden Fortress and Leni Riefenstahl?

[Raziel]

Zombie's Halloween wishes it played the beats from the original the way this flick did.

[TheVileOne]

Like Jay Z said: Fuck critics, you can kiss my whole asshole.

 

The film's 95% on Rotten Tomatoes though.

[EVA]

Pretty sure he called him Ben.

So...Coruscant, the Senate and the New Republic are just nuked now? I think the area the Starkiller attacked was the Hosnian system. Not sure what planets are there.

So is there anything left of the Republic and the Senate?

This seemed like a needless complication that I didn't understand. Why couldn't it have just been Coruscant? At least the audience has some familiarity with that planet via the prequels, so destroying it would carry some weight. But, no, it's...this other planet that we've never been to before, but basically looks just like Coruscant for the 10 seconds that we see it before it gets zapped. So weird.

And while I can't fault them for wanting to avoid all the boring political shit that ran the prequels aground, the Republic/Resistance/First Order situation is entirely nebulous within the context of the film.

[Niners Fan in CT]

Holy. Fucking. Shit. I haven't read anyone's reactions yet, I just got back in.  This was one hell of a visual experience and maybe the best acted Star Wars? I think so.. 

 

So many moments. I'll go back through this thread and read now.

 

One thing, I saw it in IMAX and I'm not sure if the 3D is necessary.

[steve]

You guys are gonna make me stay up all night and marathon a refresher so I can go see this tomorrow...

[EVA]

I was glad to see them do away with the flippy-dippy bullshit lightsaber duels, but I bet there are 12 year olds out there who grew up on the prequels wondering why the sword fights were so boring.

[EVA]

Poor Gwen Christie probably thought "This is gonna be my year, baby!" when she booked Star Wars and Hunger Games, only to get jobbed out in the edit both times.

[Raziel]

I'm kinda hoping VIII is half Phasma hunting down Finn for not only deserting, but being instrumental in destroying the Starkiller, and when Rey pulls a Luke and takes off to save him too early, she runs into a more together and harder to rattle Ren.

 

I was really disappointed by Phasma being a near non-factor, but I can see the setup to her and Finn being the Semi-final to Rey/Ren's Main Event program.  I have no idea where they really go with Poe.

 

My only other dissappointment was that since I didn't read the text material, I was guessing as to why the First Order was allowed to get so strong less than a generation post Empire and why the Republic was pretty toothless, and why the hell there needed to be a "Resistance" to a non-goverment entity.

 

Course, we don't know the extent of the First Order's Fleet.  They could just have the one Star Destroyer for all we know now.

 

Or the next movie opens with something twice the size of the Executor.

[Control]

C3PO's intro was the highlight of the film.

[Zimbra]

 

 

The script really leaned into the whole Joseph Campbell heroic journey/monomyth idea that influenced the original.

More like, the movie is almost a beat-for-beat remake of ANH. The first half, especially. It's like Rob Zombie's STAR WARS.

Does that mean it also ripped off Hidden Fortress and Leni Riefenstahl?

 

 

I haven't seen it in a while, but there are some shots that I'm pretty sure are lifted directly from Triumph of the Will.

[lostinube]

I think Adam Driver's non-threatening look is right for the character. Ren's a whiny brat who needs to look cool hence the mask. He knows that without the Grandpa Vader tribute no one will be scared of him. Also, do we know much about the Knights of Ren?

 

I think it's sort of hinted that Rey is kind of a Star Wars nerd (although you'd think she'd know the Millenium Falcon). She's always felt the Force was real, she gets confirmation and is ready to embrace it at the right time.

 

They should have used Phasma as the Stormtrooper who takes out Finn (Did the trooper call him a traitor? How would they know?). Having him get beaten by a random guy doesn't look good for him.

 

So, someone with Skywalker blood going bad, main character dead, giant megaweapon. Are there any other re-purposed Expanded Universe things going on?

 

Oh, and for all the internet fighting that it will cause, I don't want Rey to be a Skywalker. I want her to not be related (or hey, a Kenobi!) in order for there to be a Ren/Rey/Finn love triangle. Team Ren! Team Finn! Finn/Poe OTP!

[Raziel]

See, this is my question, Rey is set to be the one to fight with Ren.  Rey has zero attachment to him, and he killed a hero figure in her mind, one that helped her possible romantic interest come to rescue her, and was willing to give her a life running around the stars on the most famous ship in the galaxy.  She doesn't have a reason to attempt to redeem Kylo, not as much as say Luke had to redeem Vader.  

 

So, do they have him redeemed, or does he go down swinging.  They're not going to redo Vader turning on Sideous in the end with Kylo turning on Snoke, right?

 

I'm also in camp "Don't let Rey be a Skywalker", I'd rather it just be that she was Force Sensitive and The Force chose her to be the counter to the First Order's Wannabe Sith.

[lostinube]

He's gonna be redeemed because he's in luv with Rey. And she can't resist him cuz he's a bad boy.

[TheVileOne]

I think Adam Driver's non-threatening look is right for the character. Ren's a whiny brat who needs to look cool hence the mask. He knows that without the Grandpa Vader tribute no one will be scared of him. Also, do we know much about the Knights of Ren?

 

I think it's sort of hinted that Rey is kind of a Star Wars nerd (although you'd think she'd know the Millenium Falcon). She's always felt the Force was real, she gets confirmation and is ready to embrace it at the right time.

 

They should have used Phasma as the Stormtrooper who takes out Finn (Did the trooper call him a traitor? How would they know?). Having him get beaten by a random guy doesn't look good for him.

 

So, someone with Skywalker blood going bad, main character dead, giant megaweapon. Are there any other re-purposed Expanded Universe things going on?

 

Oh, and for all the internet fighting that it will cause, I don't want Rey to be a Skywalker. I want her to not be related (or hey, a Kenobi!) in order for there to be a Ren/Rey/Finn love triangle. Team Ren! Team Finn! Finn/Poe OTP!

 

The Knights of Ren looked like the rough kids from school who decided to resort to anarchy.

[Matt D]

Quick comments that I have to get out of the way:

 

1. The three main new characters were great. Relatable. Different. We needed more Poe.

2. Phasma was both wasted and clowned.

3. It was amusing how Ren was protected in his lightsaber fights by the Chewie shot. Good booking.

4. Chewie's physical charisma was off the charts. That shrug. 

 

Ok, two main thoughts.

 

1. This movie really wasn't for me. It was for the 13 year old I was lucky enough to introduce to Star Wars over the years and who was sitting with me, who wouldn't shut up about the physics of the planet killer, and couldn't remember Poe's name but thought he was great, who could probably relate to Ren on some level. 

 

The biggest thing the movie did wasn't killing Han. It was destroying the New Republic, just like that. It was, in one fell swoop, and after so many smaller swoops, invalidating the victory of Jedi. The story continued so there was no happy endings. We knew that. But it jettisoned everything, the idea of a new republic, of a new jedi order, of Han and  Leia together. It set everything back so that nothing in the trilogy we all grew up with ultimately ended up mattering. Just a string of failures by our heroes. And it had to do that so that this story could live on its own and not be entirely beholden to what came before, so that the stakes would actually matter. On some weird level this feels like a failure of George Lucas. He didn't carry the torch and because of that, years and years passed and this was really the only way to move forward. I'm not saying it felt like a betrayal, but it did feel like it invalidated what came before. I really do think it was necessary because it made this story its own and it made it something that a new generation can latch on to as their own and not just their parents.

 

2. As for Ren, I think that he was made possible by the prequels. I think you need petulant Episode 2 Anakin to make Ren work. It laid the groundwork for it. Instead of it being a detriment the movie made it into a strength, and the way it did that was by embracing it. In fact, almost everyone in the movie seemed more human. Whoever referenced Guardians of the Galaxy was right on that. I loved the moment where Poe asked which of them should be talking but that was the sort of thing that could never have existed before. Everyone was more grounded. It was all somehow less space opera-y in that regard but I think it was, again, a strength, because it made us relate to the story more. Star Wars, at one point, made everything dirtier and dustier and more human, and this was the next evolution of that.

[TheVileOne]

All this Phasma stuff, they were saying like a year ago she was just going to be a minor character who gets a bigger role in later films.