RAW is uncomfortably personal

[Curt McGirt]

I don't remember how good they were in the ring but I loved the Deuce and Domino gimmick. The concept of an aggressive heel team made of asshole greasers/rockers/rockabillies/raggare with a put-upon valet is perfect but the plug was pulled on it before anything could be done with it. Put a team like that under Heyman in OVW or something and he would have ran with it I bet. Turn down the Fonzie and turn up the Ace Merrill and there's a lot to work with there.

 

EDIT: and of course I look it up and they started in OVW under Heyman. Go figure

[cool arrow]

I never thought of Watts being terrible, more so just... existed?  How was Deuce/Sim Snuka?  I don't remember much from those days. Actually, DiBiase Jr. kind of sucked too.

 

Watts wasn't that bad, really; he was just ridiculously overpushed because he was the boss's kid.

[Charlie M.]

So the brawl at the end was good, but I think the people who are comparing this to "old school southern booking" are missing the point of what made that southern booking so great. It wasn't that the heel just said and did despicable things, it was that the heel doing despicable things was foreshadowed by previous actions in some fashion. Before tonight, I had no idea that Charlotte was a wrestler because of her brother. She never talked about that in promos, the announcers never made mention of it, it wasn't brought up during her title win. Paige talking about Reid was the first mention I remember of Reid on WWE programming. Let's say Charlotte wins the title and we get a vignette with her and Ric, or even a quick mention from Michael Cole about why this is so emotional for them. If Paige brings up Reid after he's been established as a place of emotional resonance for Charlotte, it shows a specific side of Paige and makes us want to hate her even more. As it stands, Paige bringing it up now makes what could be a powerful storyline in to something that is played almost purely for shock value. To me, it read almost like a villain from a soap opera, spouting off exposition and being awful at the same time. Sure I wanted to see Charlotte beat up Paige, but that was it. I didn't feel for Charlotte. It didn't seem like something that was important to her was being picked on by a former friend. It felt like dirty laundry was being aired, and that's a very different (and much less interesting) way to tell a story.

 

You summed it up pretty well.

 

The thing is they've basically spent a decade presenting this as nothing to be taken seriously. You can't just inject real life into your hokey storyline and except anyone to actually hate the silly character for it.

 

It's pretty easy to see what happened. The third hour of the show has been ratings death so they put the stuff they feel is important where the most eyeballs would see it. That left this segment to go on last. That would have been fine but they had no confidence in them to go out and do that segment without using Reid's death. Do they even get this placement on the show if Charlotte absolutely refuses to bring up Reid? Probably not and that's just sad.

[Brian Fowler]

It reminds me of a couple years ago when they kept putting Cena on at the top of the 10 o'clock hour and then left the main event slot to Punk or Bryan.

They are experimenting with moving the main event to the time people check out. They aren't giving the best slot to Charlotte and Paige.

[jstout]

What I've always admired about David Flair:

1. He dated Stacy Keibler. David Flair 1, You 0.

2. After he fizzled out in the WWF very quickly, he didn't immediately give up. He kicked around NC-TN-GA indies for a while, trying to get better. It didn't work out for him, but at least he didn't give up the minute his shot at the majors died.

[Zakk_Sabbath]

I hate to be cynical, but i'd be willing to bet that Charlotte/Paige went on last not only because of the connection to Greenville, but because many were still talking about the Rousey/Holms fight from over the weekend. I could be totally wrong, but it seems like the type of buzz WWE would try to capitalize on using their women.

[The Nature Boy]

What I've always admired about David Flair:

1. He dated Stacy Keibler. David Flair 1, You 0.

2. After he fizzled out in the WWF very quickly, he didn't immediately give up. He kicked around NC-TN-GA indies for a while, trying to get better. It didn't work out for him, but at least he didn't give up the minute his shot at the majors died.

 

David Flair wasn't bad in his team with Crowbar. I have no clue why the WWF didn't just bring them in together.

[Brian Fowler]

He was kind of a fun character, but he couldn't work a lick.

He did have that deeply uncomfortable ass whipping from Taker in the build to the Mania match. That was... Something

[Phantom Lord]

I hate to be cynical, but i'd be willing to bet that Charlotte/Paige went on last not only because of the connection to Greenville, but because many were still talking about the Rousey/Holms fight from over the weekend. I could be totally wrong, but it seems like the type of buzz WWE would try to capitalize on using their women.

 

I'm pretty sure that's what they were going for. But also knowing some within the WWE, they also probably intentionally made the segment like that just to sabotage them (not to say I can imagine it going better with good material or two people who could pull that off).

[sydneybrown]

 

Was David Flair the worst wrestler ever whose father was an all-time great?  (or the best, whatever)

So who would you put on that list? "All-time great" is obviously subjective, but here's who occurs to me as children of potential all-time greats:

David & Charlotte Flair

Dustin & Cody Rhodes

David Sammartino

David Benoit

Shaul Guerrero

Terry Funk & Dory Funk Jr.

El Hijo Del Santo

Blue Demon Jr. (adopted)

 

 

I would vote for David Sammartino.  David Flair at least gave us some amusing comedic moments. Sammartino actually attacked a fan after a match and also murdered a jobber so badly not only did Vince show that match on TNT, he literally played the near-paralysis moments in slow motion.

[CastleVania Rey]

People are sleeping on Ambrose/Ziggler. It was good stuff. Or is Ziggler so unpopular here now that people don't mention him now?

 

I liked Cesaro/Reigns too, but Reigns stopped selling the arm and that hurt the match a good deal.

[Niners Fan in CT]

If they are going to give us the main event or Cena at the top of the second hour do you think they would make the third hour a little edgier to keep at least some portion of the audience watching?  That's what I felt about the final segment. It was a little bit of Attitude in there. Southern also but obviously stuff they haven't been doing since the move to PG. I wouldn't advocate full on 1999 television but maybe stretching the PG limits could be something.

[Casey]

Flair said on his podcast that no one from WWE told him about the Reid stuff beforehand in the main event segment, and started to cry when it was mentioned on-air.

 

I'm not surprised, but damn

[MORELOCK]

Chris Benoit isn't a fucking all-time great. Jesus fucking Christ.

[Johnny Sorrow]

Is Kerry Von Eric good enough for Lacey to be the answer?

Sure, because Kerry was fucking great.

[Cristobal]

...I'm going to assume it goes without saying that I was referring to his in-ring ability rather than saying he was a swell guy, and ask why you think he wasn't?

[DreamBroken]

I also highly enjoyed Erik Watts' TNA run, too bad he pretty much disappeared after those couple years.

[PetrolCB]

 

 

Was David Flair the worst wrestler ever whose father was an all-time great?  (or the best, whatever)

So who would you put on that list? "All-time great" is obviously subjective, but here's who occurs to me as children of potential all-time greats:

David & Charlotte Flair

Dustin & Cody Rhodes

David Sammartino

David Benoit

Shaul Guerrero

Terry Funk & Dory Funk Jr.

El Hijo Del Santo

Blue Demon Jr. (adopted)

 

 

I would vote for David Sammartino.  David Flair at least gave us some amusing comedic moments. Sammartino actually attacked a fan after a match and also murdered a jobber so badly not only did Vince show that match on TNT, he literally played the near-paralysis moments in slow motion.

 

 

Any idea of which episode this was? I want to see it based on your mention.

[MORELOCK]

...I'm going to assume it goes without saying that I was referring to his in-ring ability rather than saying he was a swell guy, and ask why you think he wasn't?

 

You're mentioning him in the same breath as Flair, Dusty, Bruno, and Santo. It's not like you're listing every spawn of a good worker. I don't see Curtis Axel's name on your list.

[Cristobal]

He was in best in the world discussions for over a decade starting with the Super J Cup. He was one of about a dozen at most champions of both WCW and WWF/E. He was one of five wrestlers (I'm excluding Vince in 99) to win the Rumble from the first 5 shots spots, (the others being Flair, HBK, Austin, and Rey,) he main-evented Mania, and he topped three DVDVR 500s.

[cwoy2j]

He was kind of a fun character, but he couldn't work a lick.

He did have that deeply uncomfortable ass whipping from Taker in the build to the Mania match. That was... Something

 

Yeah, that promo where Taker is in the shower stall with David while he (David) is gasping for air and bleeding all over the place gave me Oz flashbacks.

[Technico Support]

I enjoyed Cesaro's transition from the Sharpshooter to the Crippler Crossface, a move heretofore known as "Canada's Greatest Hits."

[Patrick B.]

People are sleeping on Ambrose/Ziggler. It was good stuff. Or is Ziggler so unpopular here now that people don't mention him now?

 

I liked Cesaro/Reigns too, but Reigns stopped selling the arm and that hurt the match a good deal.

 

I actually recall Reigns grabbing the LEFT arm to sell at one point before remembering to sell the right arm...

 

...I mean, SHUT YOUR HOLE REIGNS IS AWESOME.  #prettyprettyhair

 

Liked all the tournament matches but Del Rio-Kalisto was kinda disappointing.  I feel bad for Kalisto as it seems like he struggles when the spotlight is on him(first Elimination Chamber and now here).

 

Kinda indifferent on the contract signing.  When the women got a prime spot on NXT shows, it was like "cool, they're getting the spotlight and they deserve it".  In this case, it was like "oh, okay, I guess that's going on last".

[NikoBaltimore]

Flair said on his podcast that no one from WWE told him about the Reid stuff beforehand in the main event segment, and started to cry when it was mentioned on-air.

 

I'm not surprised, but damn

So it sounds like Charlotte was the only Flair to know about this.  Come on, man, that's super fucked up.  I haven't heard the podcast yet, but if you're going to mention your dead brother it helps to at least let your immediate family know ahead of time.  And on top of that, was it her idea or the writers?

[Technico Support]

I highly doubt Ric didn't know.