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Pitchers & Catchers Report 2/17/16


RIPPA

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8/$184

Damn, Cubs.

So what's the plan in Atlanta? I've never been this detached. Of course, I've had other issues with my sports teams also. Every young player I start to like is being traded away. I didn't think the team would ever become the new Tampa Rays.

Think back to after the 2012 season when they acquired the Uptons. The team was set up for a three year contention window with JUp and Heyward hitting FA after '15. Fredi managed them to an NLDS loss in '13, and the wheels fell off in '14. They closed the window a year early and started traded the pending free agents (and thankfully, the overpaid, luxury closer) for good to great returns.

This winter, they traded Simmons (whose bat has never looked like it'll progres) for MOAR PITCHING, and sold super high on Miller, picking up the new SS of the future in the same deal.

The only guys left with value on the major league roster are Freeman, Teheran, and Inciarte, and two of them are locked up long-term to friendly deals and coming off bad years. They might flip Inciarte to turn him into more quantity position player prospects, but I doubt the other two get moved.

They'll be shit again in '16, and they'll probably be "fun" in '17 with nothing but young guys on the roster. Out of all of the trades over the last year, the only one that confused me at the time (and still does four-plus months later) was the Wood/Olivera trade, because Hacktor hadn't shown much in pro ball up til then, already may be having his position changed, and is 30.

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Wait...weren't the Phillies the first team to try and draft Appel, only for Appel to wait another year?

Pirates drafted him after he fell farther than expected because Boras. Then Boras made bluster about breaking the slot system and we should pay him like a #1 overall anyway which the Bucs were never gonna do. So he sat out.

Glad we passed on him. Honestly, I'd prefer we stay away from as many Boras guys as possible because you always end up overpaying.

Edit: ignored by Rippa *sadface*

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Wait...weren't the Phillies the first team to try and draft Appel, only for Appel to wait another year?

 

Nope - his first go in the draft, Houston had the 1st pick but wouldn't met his signing demands. He fell to Pittsburgh at 8 and went to college instead

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8/$184

Damn, Cubs.

So what's the plan in Atlanta? I've never been this detached. Of course, I've had other issues with my sports teams also. Every young player I start to like is being traded away. I didn't think the team would ever become the new Tampa Rays.

Think back to after the 2012 season when they acquired the Uptons. The team was set up for a three year contention window with JUp and Heyward hitting FA after '15. Fredi managed them to an NLDS loss in '13, and the wheels fell off in '14. They closed the window a year early and started traded the pending free agents (and thankfully, the overpaid, luxury closer) for good to great returns.

This winter, they traded Simmons (whose bat has never looked like it'll progres) for MOAR PITCHING, and sold super high on Miller, picking up the new SS of the future in the same deal.

The only guys left with value on the major league roster are Freeman, Teheran, and Inciarte, and two of them are locked up long-term to friendly deals and coming off bad years. They might flip Inciarte to turn him into more quantity position player prospects, but I doubt the other two get moved.

They'll be shit again in '16, and they'll probably be "fun" in '17 with nothing but young guys on the roster. Out of all of the trades over the last year, the only one that confused me at the time (and still does four-plus months later) was the Wood/Olivera trade, because Hacktor hadn't shown much in pro ball up til then, already may be having his position changed, and is 30.

 

 

 

I haven't had my finger on the pulse for a while now mostly because I no longer have an avenue to watch most of the games but is there anything on the horizon with the new stadium and TV revenue that could push the team back into a position where they could spend money?  Guys like Heyward I'm like okay whatever, I loved Heyward but obviously he wasn't going to be here during the rebuild, made no sense and didn't have the cash. 

 

I miss when the Braves could spend.  Of course it never helped that the stadium would be half empty during the playoffs almost like everyone was taking the team for granted like "fuck it, I'll be there if they make the World Series"

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Their TV deal is dog shit and was signed prior to the boom we're seeing now. Boondoggle Field will probably bring in more money since it'll be owned by the team and not the city, but not enough to push them into the top tier of spenders. I think their payroll will max at something like $130 or $140 in a couple years.

The thing that's amused me about this rebuild is the public talking points about building around pitching. Yeah, the 90s teams did that, but they were also a top five (at worst) payroll team, and the offense wasn't completely anemic either.

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Justice, Gant, Larry, Andruw, McGriff, Javy, Klesko...then the short term guys like Estrada, Castilla, Sheffield, Drew, Giles, etc. They're not scrubs!

And let's call a spade a spade - the only two homegrown guys that were long-term starters were Smoltz and Glavine. Avery blew out quickly. Maddux was a hired gun. Neagle was a trade. Millwood was dumped when he got expensive (and thanks to Maddux accepting arb). It's not as if the rotation was constantly churning out these top tier starters year after year.

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Amazing thing is with that really solid grouping of talent, it still completely pales in comparison to the Indians in the mid to late 90's

 

The following players were all on the Indians at various points between 96 and 99

 

Sandy Alomar, Julio Franco, Carlos Baerga, Omar Visquel, Jim Thome, Albert Belle, Kenny Lofton, Manny Ramirez, Eddie Murray, Jeromy Burnitz, Brian Giles, Jeff Kent, Tony Fernandez, Matt Williams, Marquis Grissom, Richie Sexson, Travis Fryman, Roberto Alomar, Harold Baines, David Justice.

 

Look at it. LOOK AT IT. And they didn't win a world series. Amazing.

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Amazing thing is with that really solid grouping of talent, it still completely pales in comparison to the Indians in the mid to late 90's

 

The following players were all on the Indians at various points between 96 and 99

 

Sandy Alomar, Julio Franco, Carlos Baerga, Omar Visquel, Jim Thome, Albert Belle, Kenny Lofton, Manny Ramirez, Eddie Murray, Jeromy Burnitz, Brian Giles, Jeff Kent, Tony Fernandez, Matt Williams, Marquis Grissom, Richie Sexson, Travis Fryman, Roberto Alomar, Harold Baines, David Justice.

 

Look at it. LOOK AT IT. And they didn't win a world series. Amazing.

 

The Braves only won one world championship during that time with THEIR lineup. They made it to four World Series in the 90s and only won one of them! 

 

And even if you count Maddux as a hired gun, the guy still spent a lot of time in Atlanta and was a consistent part of a rotation that included Smoltz and Glavine. The guy spent a decade in Atlanta, I'll always think of him as a Brave. 

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Be grateful if your local city has things of note. Mine has Harry Houdini, but also had Joseph McCarthy and the fuckin' John Birch Society. There's a statue of the prick or there was. Some distant older relatives worked on his family's farm.

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When Cleveland doesn't win anything and the Braves win one title with those teams, it makes one realize how great the late 90s-early 2000s Yankees teams were.

 

The Yankees were always the best at pulling it together in the post-season. The late 90s-early 2000s Yankees teams would be the best playoff teams of all time, if not for the early-mid 20th century Yankees (though the playoffs just consisted of a World Series then).

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Hey, I'll be the first to admit that the 90's Braves should have won another title but I'm thinking '96 is the year to look at. Up 2-0 headed back to Atlanta.  Then Jim Leyritz happens. The Blue Jays and the Twins were monster teams, especially the Jays.  I don't think anyone can get on Atlanta for losing those hard fought series.  1999 they were not going to beat the Yanks at that point. 1997 they ran into a Marlins team full of all-stars, I can't believe that worked out for the Marlins twice. Again in '03. Same shit, bring in a ton of guys and then get rid of them right away.

 

Also, that Indians lineup where Manny Ramirez had like 165 RBIs one year. That might have been the greatest lineup I've ever seen. Feel free to throw out some others...

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Pete Rose: "Thanks for hearing my case Commissioner Manfred.  Now, before you make your ruling, you should know... I'm still betting on baseball."

 

Rob Manfred: *starts rubbing the bridge of his nose with his thumb and index finger* "God dammit, Pete."  *stamps DENIED on reinstatement application*

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