Matt D Posted November 10, 2016 Share Posted November 10, 2016 49 minutes ago, Oyaji said: I get that WWE is archaic and racist but do you guys feel like if their best three performers were Japanese they'd really shoot themselves in the foot like that long term? I'm not so sure. Not if they think their best performer is Charlotte? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jiji Posted November 10, 2016 Share Posted November 10, 2016 My point was more hypothetical but Charlotte and Lynch are the two that would definitely be there and with their promo ability, of course they're more valuable. But if Io and Hojo got over on NXT, which honestly I'd be shocked if they didn't, would the company really shy away from pushing three Japanese women simultaneously? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt D Posted November 10, 2016 Share Posted November 10, 2016 11 minutes ago, Oyaji said: My point was more hypothetical but Charlotte and Lynch are the two that would definitely be there and with their promo ability, of course they're more valuable. But if Io and Hojo got over on NXT, which honestly I'd be shocked if they didn't, would the company really shy away from pushing three Japanese women simultaneously? I actually have no idea what they'll do with Nakamura/Tozawa/KENTA if they all came up at once. Likewise Dorada(1 and 2), and Sin Cara and Kalisto. They pretty much only have one speed when it comes to these. Have they ever really had a Japanese or Mexican person on the main roster where their gimmick wasn't that they were Japanese or Mexican? Where that wasn't 90% of it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kevin Wilson Posted November 10, 2016 Share Posted November 10, 2016 I think there are times its appropriate to look at a promotion's history and figure how they will book their wrestlers, as long as Vince is calling the shots, I can't fathom a scenario that three foreign wrestlers with limited promo skills are going to be at the top of any division. Like I said before, I figured with Kairi that she would just have to 'wait' and slowly build up like Ember Moon while Io could probably get pushed faster. Or they could send Io to SmackDown. It may also just come down to money, if Stardom upped their offers, does the WWE care enough about bringing them over to up it more? Give them 'guarantees' on pushes or what brand they will be on? If Io and Kairi felt too loyal to leave then they wouldn't have explored the option in the first place, so like most things in life it will likely come down to the contracts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trocar Slush Weasel Posted November 10, 2016 Share Posted November 10, 2016 1 hour ago, Oyaji said: I get that WWE is archaic and racist but do you guys feel like if their best three performers were Japanese they'd really shoot themselves in the foot like that long term? I'm not so sure. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jiji Posted November 10, 2016 Share Posted November 10, 2016 The best response. And I understand Vince's long-term history of booking foreigners. I mean, Cesaro is too foreign for him ffs. But, WWE with Stephanie as CHIEF BRAND OFFICER (lol), may want to steer the company in a different, less 1950s racist direction. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kevin Wilson Posted November 10, 2016 Share Posted November 10, 2016 I actually hate saying this, especially since I obviously am a fan of Japanese wrestling, but I wouldn't blame WWE for not wanting three foreigners getting a heavy push at the same time. I have family members that watch WWE that don't like Shinsuke because he is a 'weird Japanese guy', Asuka seems to be the odd talent that overcomes that, but WWE would probably be right that the average fan may not want so many foreign stars. That is something that could change with either education or forcing a wrestler until the fans accept it (which isn't usually a good idea), but that is likely more work than the WWE feels like doing. I think NXT would accept them all no problem since NXT fans tend to be a bit more open minded for whatever reason, but I am not sure about the main crowds. Even as much as I love Asuka and NXT does too, I am not even sure how RAW or SD crowds would embrace her. The "casual" fan has been hardwired a specific way that wrestling is, it takes someone with a really special ability to connect with the crowd if they don't fit that mold, like Daniel Bryan did. Asuka may be able to also, but expecting all three to be able to is likely asking too much Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clintthecrippler Posted November 10, 2016 Share Posted November 10, 2016 I wouldn't hold my breath waiting for Asuka, Io, and Hojo to be in the Charlotte/Becky/Sasha positions two years from now. But I wouldn't be surprised if WWE tried to bring them in as a faction at some point ala Kaientai or Tajiri/Akio/Sakoda where Asuka is the star of the group and the other two are there to take falls in six person tags or to lose to whoever is next to challenge Asuka. Though of course, being in those positions would probably be a lot of pride swallowing for Hojo and Io. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kevin Wilson Posted November 10, 2016 Share Posted November 10, 2016 2 hours ago, clintthecrippler said: I wouldn't hold my breath waiting for Asuka, Io, and Hojo to be in the Charlotte/Becky/Sasha positions two years from now. But I wouldn't be surprised if WWE tried to bring them in as a faction at some point ala Kaientai or Tajiri/Akio/Sakoda where Asuka is the star of the group and the other two are there to take falls in six person tags or to lose to whoever is next to challenge Asuka. Though of course, being in those positions would probably be a lot of pride swallowing for Hojo and Io. Especially Io. I could see Kairi putting up with it as it would still give her a chance to get over and they could have her turn on Asuka if she did, but I can't fathom Io coming to WWE just to be Asuka's "second." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
.STAP Posted November 11, 2016 Share Posted November 11, 2016 So Io turned on Mayu after losing the tag league to Hojo & Bito, and then revealed a new tag partner who is totally not Hazaki Reo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trocar Slush Weasel Posted November 11, 2016 Share Posted November 11, 2016 38 minutes ago, .STAP said: So Io turned on Mayu after losing the tag league to Hojo & Bito, and then revealed a new tag partner who is totally not Hazaki Reo. They are doing this so wrong. I tried to help them but they wouldn't listen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hoope Posted November 11, 2016 Share Posted November 11, 2016 Doing literally a month or 2 of buildup and angles on ONE show with a team that didn't lose once in the tournament and is just randomly having issues not only makes this hard to sell, but look contrived and rushed(which it is, yeah but still). Kyona/Momo shouldve won and went on to win the Tag Titles at the Climax show. Stardom really isn't good at building things up despite having the right pieces to build things up Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eivion Posted November 11, 2016 Share Posted November 11, 2016 I actually saw it coming. Mayu has needed to move a bit more on her own, and Io made some sort of comment hinting towards not being the happiest when she agreed for Thunder Rock to partner up for the tournament. I agree they could have built it better, but I'm not really sure why the complaints. They wanted it to happen on a bigger show, and depending on whether or not Io & Kairi are gone in 5-6 months they probably needed to push it sooner than later. I'm just happy to see some sort of story happening and that Reo is back. 50 minutes ago, Hoope said: Kyona/Momo shouldve won and went on to win the Tag Titles at the Climax show. Is there any reason other than your fandom for that to have been a realistic and sensible possibility? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hoope Posted November 11, 2016 Share Posted November 11, 2016 26 minutes ago, Eivion said: Is there any reason other than your fandom for that to have been a realistic and sensible possibility? Because theyre ready for it, it puts new people over instead of the same fucking 4 which you should be doing whether or not ANYONE is leaving, and are a great way to get the tag belts off Kimura/Oedotai before she retires instead of it going to the same people or some crappy gaijin team? Sensible possibility? They were. New team, work great together, Kyona being great within a year and Momo going strong, wrestling Oedo Tai on every single show cuz that's the direction, apparently? Yeah, they were definitely the only team that should've won. Literally none of the 4 need it, Kagetsu already has the tag belts and was working with someone that wasnt Kimura and the other teams just aren't good enough. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
.STAP Posted November 11, 2016 Share Posted November 11, 2016 Thunder Rock were doing LOS taunts on last week's show and now Io's mysterious friend is being called "pareja". Naito's influence. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eivion Posted November 11, 2016 Share Posted November 11, 2016 9 minutes ago, Hoope said: Because theyre ready for it, it puts new people over instead of the same fucking 4 which you should be doing whether or not ANYONE is leaving, and are a great way to get the tag belts off Kimura/Oedotai before she retires instead of it going to the same people or some crappy gaijin team? Sensible possibility? They were. New team, work great together, Kyona being great within a year and Momo going strong, wrestling Oedo Tai on every single show cuz that's the direction, apparently? Yeah, they were definitely the only team that should've won. Literally none of the 4 need it, Kagetsu already has the tag belts and was working with someone that wasnt Kimura and the other teams just aren't good enough. Except they really aren't. Kyona is solid, but she isn't some super rookie, and Momo is inconsistent along with barely being out of the rookie phase. Going as far as you want them to doesn't elevate them so much as it makes others lesser. At best they should have made the finals over Io & Mayu. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hoope Posted November 11, 2016 Share Posted November 11, 2016 2 hours ago, Eivion said: Going as far as you want them to doesn't elevate them so much as it makes others lesser You're kidding All of the 4 have been through much much worse this year as far as looking hilariously weak from having to sell for shitty gaijin who basically bring the matches theyre in and the product itself down heavily this year. 2 of them putting over a good tag team in a tag tournment(cuz Yoko/Kairi didn't need to be in finals either) where only one takes the fall and it doesn't even have to be super clean/decisive wouldn't do a damn thing to anyone but elevate Momo and Kyona. Don't kid yourself. Io looks weaker selling for KRIS WOLF and going to a draw with her than Momo and Kyona winning a tag tournament over her in a promotion that's fallen off booking and product wise this year and could benefit from someone NEW being built up and looking strong as the year ends instead of just 2 of the golden 4 winning something else for no reason. A good thing that came out today(for me at least), The OZ Yokohama card looks absolutely amazing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Overly Critical Man Posted November 11, 2016 Share Posted November 11, 2016 5 hours ago, .STAP said: So Io turned on Mayu after losing the tag league to Hojo & Bito, and then revealed a new tag partner who is totally not Hazaki Reo. They'll both end up jobbing to Toni Storm and Chelsea Green so what's the point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kevin Wilson Posted November 11, 2016 Share Posted November 11, 2016 I'd have to agree with @Hoope in this case, there wouldn't have been any harm in giving two up and coming wrestlers the tag league (or at least having them do better) and not two established wrestlers that didn't need the win. Even if winning the tag league gets them a title shot that they then lose, its still giving their younger wrestlers some experience and exposure, as well as a chance at having a bigger match. Stardom has put their top wrestlers on such a high pedestal, giving younger wrestlers a win now and then won't hurt those stars. I just don't think the Tag League is prestigious enough that it would have hurt the wrestlers or the promotion to let two young wrestlers shine in it, and I do think that Kyona is really good and ready for at least some shots at the lower level titles in Stardom. I mean a promotion with about 10 contracted wrestlers has six different titles with nine individual belts, Momo or Kyona challenging for one wouldn't hurt anything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eivion Posted November 11, 2016 Share Posted November 11, 2016 35 minutes ago, Kevin Wilson said: I mean a promotion with about 10 contracted wrestlers has six different titles with nine individual belts, Momo or Kyona challenging for one wouldn't hurt anything. They can do that anyways w/o big tournament wins. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kevin Wilson Posted November 11, 2016 Share Posted November 11, 2016 2 minutes ago, Eivion said: They can do that anyways w/o big tournament wins. I guess I would argue its not a big tournament. Its just a tournament, no Korakuen Hall finale, sandwiched between their big events. It is just a tournament to make the house shows interesting between Samurai TV tapings. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dshuks Posted November 11, 2016 Share Posted November 11, 2016 Honestly I really hope Io decides not to stay with Stardom. She's done everything she can do there and has exhausted every worthwhile match with the roster basically , and has really hit the ceiling for how big of a "star" a wrestler can be in the current joshi scene I also think Io would be an even bigger success than Asuka in WWE, as her style is farm more exciting and fast paced to the Americn audience. You could literally do a female Rey Mysterio gimmick with her if WWE wanted to , call her Tiger Io or something and she can wrestle with one of her tiger masks on. I honestly think Io is held back by how limited the Stardom roster is at the moment, she can't even really do a lot of her luca spots anymore because nobody else other than herself is a good base for ranas and stuff. Kairi outside of her elbow drop is just no impressive/flashy enough of a wrestler to stand out in the WWE. i honestly wise the WWE and never contacted her as I doubt Rossy and friends would have tried as hard to keep IO if only Io was thinking of leaving. Is It definite that they're staying? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eivion Posted November 11, 2016 Share Posted November 11, 2016 19 minutes ago, Kevin Wilson said: I guess I would argue its not a big tournament. Its just a tournament, no Korakuen Hall finale, sandwiched between their big events. It is just a tournament to make the house shows interesting between Samurai TV tapings. The thing is they have always used this tournament to establish big teams. Aikawa/Bito, Nanae/Kairi, & Thunder Rock were the other teams to have won this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kevin Wilson Posted November 11, 2016 Share Posted November 11, 2016 12 minutes ago, Dshuks said: Honestly I really hope Io decides not to stay with Stardom. She's done everything she can do there and has exhausted every worthwhile match with the roster basically , and has really hit the ceiling for how big of a "star" a wrestler can be in the current joshi scene I also think Io would be an even bigger success than Asuka in WWE, as her style is farm more exciting and fast paced to the Americn audience. You could literally do a female Rey Mysterio gimmick with her if WWE wanted to , call her Tiger Io or something and she can wrestle with one of her tiger masks on. I honestly think Io is held back by how limited the Stardom roster is at the moment, she can't even really do a lot of her luca spots anymore because nobody else other than herself is a good base for ranas and stuff. Kairi outside of her elbow drop is just no impressive/flashy enough of a wrestler to stand out in the WWE. i honestly wise the WWE and never contacted her as I doubt Rossy and friends would have tried as hard to keep IO if only Io was thinking of leaving. Is It definite that they're staying? I think its just to the point that no one knows. They have an offer from both WWE and Stardom, maybe they personally have decided but it doesn't sound like they have told either side a final answer yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
.STAP Posted November 11, 2016 Share Posted November 11, 2016 Rossy tweeted something along of the lines of this being a "reset" for Stardom, a possible turning point, and that there are great expectations for Mayu. The new Threedom is now Hojo, Mayu and Bito. I wonder if this means Hojo will stay. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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