1JoshI Posted November 17, 2016 Share Posted November 17, 2016 Off the top of my head, joshi who would have had their primes between 1998-2009 (I'm sure to forget people) Momoe Nakanishi (AJW) Azumi Hyuga (JWP) Yoshiko Tamura & Misae Genki (NEO) maybe Ayumi Kurihara (was around a few years past 2009) A lot of the ARSION roster had their peak in this period who either debuted before and/or hung around afterwards: Mariko Yoshida, Ayako Hamada, AKINO, Candy Okutsu, Hiromi Yagi, Yumi Fukawa, Michiko Ohmukai, even GAMI was probably at her best Maybe some Jd' people like The Bloody, Sumie Sakie, Megumi Yabushita Maybe some GAEA/OZ people like Sugar Sato, Toshie Uematsu, Carlos Amano, Ran Yu-Yu Surely not all of these would make a Top 100 list, but some would certainly make mine. I think the hardest thing about these lists is: a) how to rank those that are active and in their prime and still adding to their case--the Kanas and Io Shirais of the world b) how to rank those that are still active but haven't been in their prime for years--do you penalize people like Dynamite Kansai and Kyoko Inoue for hanging on for too long while people like Hikari Fukuoka & Sakie Hasegawa quit while still young and thus never had a mediocre back-end to their career Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JML Posted November 17, 2016 Share Posted November 17, 2016 22 hours ago, 1JoshI said: Do PUNQ's reviews still exist anywhere on the net? Oh, and the 11/9 Sendai Girls show is great. You'll want to watch everything except the ubiquitous Alex Lee match. Even the Eiger comedy match is a bit better than usual, because Hikaru Shida. Also, it was clipped pretty hard. C-Hash and Miyagi really came through in the main event, and I was a bit worried about them being able to pull off a Korakuen worthy main. The semi-main is a great tag between Meiko & Ayako vs Aja & Hiroyo. I'm a bit worried that DASH Chisako is becoming too enamored with the idea of being a hardcore wrestler, though. You can try looking at PUNQ's reviews through the way back machine. https://web.archive.org/web/20080411063728/http://groups.msn.com/PUNQTapes/reviews.msnw? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1JoshI Posted November 17, 2016 Share Posted November 17, 2016 Keep in mind PUNQ is pretty damned stingy with the snowflakes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JML Posted November 17, 2016 Share Posted November 17, 2016 13 hours ago, Kevin Wilson said: I am in the process of starting the contemplating phase of making a Top 100 Joshi Wrestlers Ever List. I realize these are subjective and there is no right or wrong answer, my only concern is I'll accidentally leave off someone. I know I'll have Chigusa higher than most and Bull lower than most, but besides that my Top 10 should match most peoples even if the order is different. My "gap" in viewing is like 1998 to 2009. Which I realize is a hell of a gap, that part of Joshi isn't talked about much so I've mostly been focusing on 1985 to 1995, then current day. I've seen matches here and there in that range, but not enough for example to get a good feel of how Manami Toyota was post her big AJW run. So while its impossible to watch everything, I do feel like I need to do a bit more in that era before diving too strong into it. I think the hardest part of these lists is deciding where to put wrestlers still in their prime today. Has Io done enough to be on the list? Kana? If I put them on the list now and they have five to ten more years of wrestling, where would that put them then? I don't want to do only retired wrestlers since so many Legends are still wrestling, so its one of those things that no matter what I do with the current bigger stars someone will take exception to it. Just be prepared for the backlash to your list when it starts floating around on twitter. I wouldn't mind seeing the results of a Joshi GWE Project that had the same rules as the PWO GWE Project. Would be interesting since Joshi wasn't really represented in the top 100 in the PWO GWE. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kevin Wilson Posted November 17, 2016 Share Posted November 17, 2016 9 minutes ago, JML said: Just be prepared for the backlash to your list when it starts floating around on twitter. I wouldn't mind seeing the results of a Joshi GWE Project that had the same rules as the PWO GWE Project. Would be interesting since Joshi wasn't really represented in the top 100 in the PWO GWE. The PWO guys are a bit more hardcore than I am. Which works for them, but I don't plan on watching every match and having an exact list I can fully justify. Sometimes you just have to go with the eye test, my Top 10 I'd probably really scrutinize but when you get to a certain point you're just estimating anyway. I can deal with backlash since I actually do watch it, most backlash is when someone is placed way too high, way too long, or isn't the right wrestler at all. I don't think normal people would care if I had their favorite wrestler 10 places lower than they'd want, and those people are people I likely don't care about their opinions anyway But I likely will do a Current Wrestlers List first and worry about All Time maybe in the Spring when I have more time to catch up on a few eras I want to watch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eivion Posted November 17, 2016 Share Posted November 17, 2016 1 hour ago, JML said: You can try looking at PUNQ's reviews through the way back machine. https://web.archive.org/web/20080411063728/http://groups.msn.com/PUNQTapes/reviews.msnw? Thanks for this. Not sure why I didn't think to use the web archive for his stuff. 1 hour ago, 1JoshI said: Keep in mind PUNQ is pretty damned stingy with the snowflakes That annoyed me at first, but I got used to it after a while, especially since I liked talking with him on boards. I'm curious Kevin, will your list just be Japanese women or include gaijin who spend/spent a decent amount of time in Japan? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kevin Wilson Posted November 17, 2016 Share Posted November 17, 2016 35 minutes ago, Eivion said: I'm curious Kevin, will your list just be Japanese women or include gaijin who spend/spent a decent amount of time in Japan? To keep myself more sane, I'd stick to just Japanese women on both the current and all time list. Otherwise I'd have to make up a cut-off on how many matches a gaijin would have to have had in Japan which gets dicey, plus then people would ask why I didn't include her accomplishments outside of Japan and its not a road I want to go down. Once I am feeling list-happy, I'd probably later make a separate list of top gaijin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kevin Wilson Posted November 18, 2016 Share Posted November 18, 2016 Hiroyo Matsumoto's Anniversary Show on 7/31/16 had some unique match-ups, I am still annoyed that Mayu/Shida/Kotori only went four minutes but seeing Yoshida again brought some warmth to my cold heart. I enjoyed the main event a lot, and so I wasn't being a complete tease to the Joshi fan community I uploaded it: You can read my full event review here. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ligerbusa Posted November 20, 2016 Share Posted November 20, 2016 Just watched the tag league finals. Io said she was going to bring Mayu into her new unit with HZK but decided against it because Mayu has lost all the fire she once had. Kairi was great on after the match, trying to get Mayu to insult Io, shooing Rosa away and just being Kairi. Match was good but a bit tough to watch knowing the outcome. Crowd was hot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eivion Posted November 20, 2016 Share Posted November 20, 2016 That match was going so well until the turn by Io. It made the finish awkward. Really wish they waited until after the match. Would have justified Io's decision even moreso. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eivion Posted November 20, 2016 Share Posted November 20, 2016 So if one more person turns on Mayu does that officially make her Japanese Sting? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
.STAP Posted November 20, 2016 Share Posted November 20, 2016 It's Heisei Army all over again. Oh, and it's nice to see that Starlight Kid is still alive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hoope Posted November 20, 2016 Share Posted November 20, 2016 2015 Stardom feels decades and centuries old This is so bad and so wrong, we're back to this faction stuff from 2 years ago they can't do Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dshuks Posted November 20, 2016 Share Posted November 20, 2016 My main problem is that it breaks up JKGreen , which was a nice tag team with a ton of potential. On the plus side seeing Reo back, makes mrs remember what a natural heel she is. On another note do people see Momo pulling a Yuhi or Koguma and leaving when she turns 18? For some reason I see her sticking with wrestling, I obviously have no inside knowledge but she seems like she's closer with the older girls than the likes of Koguma was. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
.STAP Posted November 20, 2016 Share Posted November 20, 2016 Koguma didn't leave. She got fired for committing the horrible offense of having a boyfriend. It's hard to say with how things go in joshi. She could stay for years, she could be gone next year. If I were to do a dead pool of who in Stardom will retire soon, I'd say Hiromi. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eivion Posted November 20, 2016 Share Posted November 20, 2016 Where did you get Koguma being fired over a boyfriend from? I'm fine with the current changes. Heel Io is fun. Reo was a natural heel, and I'm curious to see how Momo performs differently with the turn. Its nice to see things change up some. I liked JKGreen, but I couldn't see them moving up much when one is still a rookie. 30 minutes ago, Hoope said: 2015 Stardom feels decades and centuries old This is so bad and so wrong, we're back to this faction stuff from 2 years ago they can't do Why is it bad? Why can't they do it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Nixon Posted November 20, 2016 Share Posted November 20, 2016 12 minutes ago, .STAP said: Koguma didn't leave. She got fired for committing the horrible offense of having a boyfriend. It's hard to say with how things go in joshi. She could stay for years, she could be gone next year. If I were to do a dead pool of who in Stardom will retire soon, I'd say Hiromi. That is not why Koguma is gone lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
.STAP Posted November 20, 2016 Share Posted November 20, 2016 14 minutes ago, we.are.stardom said: That is not why Koguma is gone lol Well, that's the 2ch scoop. Feel free to drop a hint. There are 3 rules that joshi trainees must follow: No beer, no smoking and no boys. Koguma doesn't look like a smoker or a drinker, so most people (2ch, other circles) assume that it is the latter. Hikari Minami 'left' Ice Ribbon for the same reason, but there are actually pictures with her significant other (Naoshi Sano) in that case. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kevin Wilson Posted November 20, 2016 Share Posted November 20, 2016 Well I am sure they have more rules than that You also have to consider the possibility that her family didn't want her to do it anymore, she didn't want to do it anymore, failing grades, missing curfew, general insubordination, etc. I think there are probably a dozen reasons that < 18 year old wrestlers stop wrestling, which is one reason I try not to get too excited about any Joshi wrestler until they are at least 20 as by that point they are probably more serious about staying in the business for at least a few years. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
.STAP Posted November 20, 2016 Share Posted November 20, 2016 I am well aware of that, but in Koguma's case she was reprimanded multiple times and finally let out. It wasn't a decision on her part to leave Stardom... which naturally leads people to draw conclusions on what got her fired. https://twitter.com/wwr_stardom/status/643693517089280000 Here's the news of her release. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kevin Wilson Posted November 20, 2016 Share Posted November 20, 2016 Well right, that would imply it was things like general insubordination, missing curfews, etc., not her having a boyfriend. Plus the translation (which admittedly may be off, it usually is with Twitter) doesn't make it clear who decided she was resigning, like if she was making mistakes and wasn't willing to fix them, or she was making mistakes and they told her to get out. My point was more there are lots of reasons sub 18 year olds leave and they seem to protect privacy a lot more in Japan than they do in the US so we rarely know what the real reason is unless its something like the wrestler gets married or the wrestler is honest about it afterwards. I'm not really a gossipmonger so I don't really look around for it myself, I usually default to "its none of my business." Don't forget when Kana announced she was going on hiatus everyone said it was because she was pregnant or getting married, rumors around the 'net are rarely accurate when it comes to Japan. And I don't think stating a rumor found on message board as fact is a good idea as others reading it may not know its just a rumor started on the Internet with no factual support. I knew it was just a baseless rumor but others here may not be as aware of the situation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
donsem43 Posted November 20, 2016 Share Posted November 20, 2016 11 hours ago, Hoope said: This is so bad and so wrong, we're back to this faction stuff from 2 years ago they can't do Because Dragon Gate draws better than they do so might as well copy them. Ice Ribbon is basically doing the same thing as DDT/BJW. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hoope Posted November 20, 2016 Share Posted November 20, 2016 2 hours ago, donsem43 said: Because Dragon Gate draws better than they do so might as well copy them. Ice Ribbon is basically doing the same thing as DDT/BJW. DG knows what theyre doing and has for years. IDK about IR "doing the same thing", maybe in shuffling cards so it doesn't get repetitive like some other feds, but they're the best male and female promotions in Japan so I guess they have the right formula BTW, Ice Ribbon's Shinkiba show on 11/3 is probably joshi show of the year, or at least top 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
donsem43 Posted November 20, 2016 Share Posted November 20, 2016 I meant more in how they market the promotion rather than booking. Rossy used factions in Arsion to but I doubt he would be as willing to use them again if another group hadn't been successful with them in the meantime. I do second the Ice Ribbon show recommendation. Very good, top to bottom show. Both title matches deliver and even the two opening matches are solid stuff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eivion Posted November 20, 2016 Share Posted November 20, 2016 What Ice Ribbon show are you speaking of? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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