Raw is Sting 3-16-15

[Burgundy LaRue]

If anything, this shows that both Bryan and Reigns were brought back at the wrong time.  If Reigns was always on tap to win RR, bring him back as a surprise entrant and let him wreck shop.  Bring back Bryan on RAW following RR, have him ask Reigns for a championship match down the road should Reigns beat Lesnar at WM and then have someone confront Bryan about trying to cut line in order to get back the belt.  Reigns moves on to Lesnar and Bryan can build a feud with whoever confronted him.  You'd have to find Reigns something to do at Fastlane, but something could be whipped up.

[JCM]

Burgundy LaRue, on 17 Mar 2015 - 09:33 AM, said:

IMO, Bryan's de-push doesn't have as much to do with Reigns, but rather Vince just not wanting Bryan at the top, regardless of who else is being pushed.

I agree they're just slotting Bryan into the spot they've always wanted him at. Of course it would help if any other face on the roster was even remotely close to being as over as him so the depush wouldn't stick out like a sore thumb. 

[Ramsey]

 

Burgundy LaRue, on 17 Mar 2015 - 09:33 AM, said:

IMO, Bryan's de-push doesn't have as much to do with Reigns, but rather Vince just not wanting Bryan at the top, regardless of who else is being pushed.

I agree they're just slotting Bryan into the spot they've always wanted him at. Of course it would help if any other face on the roster was even remotely close to being as over as him so the depush wouldn't stick out like a sore thumb. 

 

That's exactly it. The de-push of Bryan is just as unnatural and ham-fisted as the super push for Reigns. It doesn't feel organic at all and the fans know it. Maybe I'm wrong and Roman will get the Hulk Hogan pop at the end of Mania. I doubt it.

[Buy Me a Burrito]

There's nothing wrong with Bryan being in the spot they are slotting him in. That's the thing nobody is seeing. Reigns has been keyed in as being the next Cena/Hogan since his first appearance in the WWE. There's nothing wrong with Bryan being in the CM Punk/Savage spot. That's a good spot, especially for a guy who spent the last year with a fucked up neck.

[Ramsey]

There's nothing wrong with Bryan being in the spot they are slotting him in. That's the thing nobody is seeing. Reigns has been keyed in as being the next Cena/Hogan since his first appearance in the WWE. There's nothing wrong with Bryan being in the CM Punk/Savage spot. That's a good spot, especially for a guy who spent the last year with a fucked up neck.

While I agree with you in theory, it feels like they (Vince) want Bryan well lower than Punk/Savage. The IC title is where heat goes to die.

[Burgundy LaRue]

I think people see it, but are looking for reasons not to believe it.  Bryan is wonderful, but at no point has he ever been seen as THE guy.  A great guy and a guy you want around?  Absolutely.  But at the very top of the card?  No.  Fandom has blinded some to the basics: the chosen face of the franchise will be put over other guys in some fashion early in his career. 

 

Reigns' readiness can be debated, and has been nearly to death.  But I suspect that was in consideration as well and that he would probably be further ahead if not for the hernia surgery.  As it is, he's doing a good job of playing catch-up. 

 

Either way with either opinion, Reigns is the chosen one and has been for some time.

[Cole Miner]

I only caught the tail end of Rusev's lawyer watching live. I figured it wasn't meant to be taken seriously since they were trashing him when I turned it on. Just went back and watched it all and damn was it funny. Claire Lynch was Katharine Hepburn compared to that guy. They micromanage things to the point of having fans change clothing yet they let that guy in the ring with a mic. Promoting a top match for the most important show of the year. While they still have David Otunga under contract. Amazing that some people still think these people are competent.

[Patrick B.]

Bryan will have a good heel run in a few months.

[Brysynner]

I think people see it, but are looking for reasons not to believe it.  Bryan is wonderful, but at no point has he ever been seen as THE guy.  A great guy and a guy you want around?  Absolutely.  But at the very top of the card?  No.  Fandom has blinded some to the basics: the chosen face of the franchise will be put over other guys in some fashion early in his career. 

 

Reigns' readiness can be debated, and has been nearly to death.  But I suspect that was in consideration as well and that he would probably be further ahead if not for the hernia surgery.  As it is, he's doing a good job of playing catch-up. 

 

Either way with either opinion, Reigns is the chosen one and has been for some time.

 

In this way Reigns probably will have the easiest time at the top because his supporting cast is likely to be around awhile. Orton/Cena/Wyatt/Rollins/Bryan/Ambrose/Ziggler are mid-30s and younger. The guys Cena had to work with were JBL/HBK/HHH/Eddie/Benoit/Orton. JBL couldn't stay long, HBK didn't want to be in the title picture, Eddie died, Benoit nuff said. So he was really left with HHH and Orton as the main guys to work with while other guys were sprinkled in

[JohnnyJ]

There's nothing wrong with Bryan being in the spot they are slotting him in. That's the thing nobody is seeing. Reigns has been keyed in as being the next Cena/Hogan since his first appearance in the WWE. There's nothing wrong with Bryan being in the CM Punk/Savage spot. That's a good spot, especially for a guy who spent the last year with a fucked up neck.

 

i agree that the Savage/Punk spot is a good spot. Right now Bryan is not near that spot. 

 

Once Punk attained main event status he had a top feud at two manias and would've had a third if he stuck around. He was never for a moment dropped down to the ic title level.

 

Right now, Bryan is closer to the Dolph Ziggler spot. 

[oh_tag]

I think what people are upset about is that Bryan should have had the opportunity at being THE guy. There was no real reason not to go with him, beyond Vince's antiqued way of thinking what a star is. In today's climate, Bryan has a ton more crossover appeal and relatability than Reigns does, and he's a hell of a lot cooler. The point is, he was more over the last two years than most people who got the chance to be The Guy, but they never once seemed to be the least bit interested in testing the waters. As Meltzer said, people just really, really like Bryan. Why even question it? There is no logical reason I can think of, other than he's not the guy simply because he wasn't chosen to be the guy. But Reigns is not the guy. That's just not what people want today, even a much better, less damaged version of Reigns. But now he's damaged, possibly beyond repair with a certain section of the fanbase and I'm sorry, but he's really just not very good. There's no magical solution to this. He will get eaten alive at Mania and the Raw after and it's going to be very hard to come back from that. To be the face of the company for the next 10 years? Impossible, but i'm sure they'll try to persevere. But for all the "oh he's improving" and pats on the head certain people seem to be giving him, I can't think of any guy who people care less about who has been in this position before. I'm sure eventually they'll try and spin him as some Cena-lite controversial figure but that was never what they were going for. They'll be lucky to get Sheamus-lite, just without him actually being any good. 

[oh_tag]

 

I think people see it, but are looking for reasons not to believe it.  Bryan is wonderful, but at no point has he ever been seen as THE guy.  A great guy and a guy you want around?  Absolutely.  But at the very top of the card?  No.  Fandom has blinded some to the basics: the chosen face of the franchise will be put over other guys in some fashion early in his career. 

 

Reigns' readiness can be debated, and has been nearly to death.  But I suspect that was in consideration as well and that he would probably be further ahead if not for the hernia surgery.  As it is, he's doing a good job of playing catch-up. 

 

Either way with either opinion, Reigns is the chosen one and has been for some time.

 

In this way Reigns probably will have the easiest time at the top because his supporting cast is likely to be around awhile. Orton/Cena/Wyatt/Rollins/Bryan/Ambrose/Ziggler are mid-30s and younger. The guys Cena had to work with were JBL/HBK/HHH/Eddie/Benoit/Orton. JBL couldn't stay long, HBK didn't want to be in the title picture, Eddie died, Benoit nuff said. So he was really left with HHH and Orton as the main guys to work with while other guys were sprinkled in

 

 

On the contrary, Cena was the right guy at the right time. He was really, really popular, and also pretty good in general. The fact that all of those guys were aging, or stale, or simply not very good made it even more clear. 

 

Reigns is nowhere near as good as Cena was, and even less popular. He's also getting the opportunity over a bunch of guys who are lot more popular, and better, and people feel deserve the opportunity more. It's only going to make them resent Reigns even more. Not to mention crowds are really quite different and less accepting of what the company is going to give them now compared to even just a few years ago. 

[Brysynner]

I think what people are upset about is that Bryan should have had the opportunity at being THE guy. There was no real reason not to go with him, beyond Vince's antiqued way of thinking what a star is. In today's climate, Bryan has a ton more crossover appeal and relatability than Reigns does, and he's a hell of a lot cooler. The point is, he was more over the last two years than most people who got the chance to be The Guy, but they never once seemed to be the least bit interested in testing the waters. As Meltzer said, people just really, really like Bryan. Why even question it? There is no logical reason I can think of, other than he's not the guy simply because he wasn't chosen to be the guy. But Reigns is not the guy. That's just not what people want today, even a much better, less damaged version of Reigns. But now he's damaged, possibly beyond repair with a certain section of the fanbase and I'm sorry, but he's really just not very good. There's no magical solution to this. He will get eaten alive at Mania and the Raw after and it's going to be very hard to come back from that. To be the face of the company for the next 10 years? Impossible, but i'm sure they'll try to persevere. But for all the "oh he's improving" and pats on the head certain people seem to be giving him, I can't think of any guy who people care less about who has been in this position before. I'm sure eventually they'll try and spin him as some Cena-lite controversial figure but that was never what they were going for. They'll be lucky to get Sheamus-lite, just without him actually being any good. 

 

Is relatability something we want in our pro-wrestlers? When did wrestling go away from the larger than life characters to the relatable guys?

[Go2Sleep]

Is relatability something we want in our pro-wrestlers? When did wrestling go away from the larger than life characters to the relatable guys?

 

The mid-90s.

 

Not that the two qualities are mutually exclusive, mind you. You can have a good mix of over-the-top and down-to-earth on the same show, and even within the same character.

[oh_tag]

Why not both? That's a bit of a problem with the whole there can be only One The Guy thing. But I agree with you that there should be larger than life characters, too. Is that Reigns? I don't think so. I do believe that the type of guy Bryan is (and Punk too) is what a lot of the audience gravitates towards today. And the mainstream media they so crave is seemingly the same. Those two guys have got them more mainstream press than anyone post-Cena. 

[Zakk_Sabbath]

Austin/McMahon was pretty relatable

[MoeCristyV.1.6]

 

 Daniel Bryan Ramsey

 

TEAM HELL(S) NO KITCHEN

 

RAW! RAW! RAW!

[JonnyLaw]

I kind of love that Ambrose and Harper are wearing the exact same clothes, but that Harper's outfit was a specific part of a character sketch that had the words "unwashed swamp monster" in it.

 

I expect someone in creative to notice this and have them start teaming together soon.  It would probably be good for Harper's character development.

 

Why do wrestling fans get mad when douchebags get kicked out of a show?

 

Game recognizes game.

[The Natural]

Big Sting fan since I started watching wrestling say five or six years old. Love Sting vs. the n.W.o from September 1996-December 1997. amazing seeing Sting finally debut in the WWE at Survivor Series last year and the ending to RAW last night was awesome, swinging that baseball bat and whipping ass! Sting looks in great shape. Sting and The Undertaker's entrances at WrestleMania 31 will be a spectacle.

[The Natural]

Forgot to add I'm glad WWE brought back the sit down video packages on Brock Lesnar and his opponent.

 

This is still one of the best video packages I've watched in wrestling:

 

 

The Brock Lesnar video did a great job making Lesnar different with the sit down interview, the things he said and the list of the championships he's won.

[Burgundy LaRue]

I think what people are upset about is that Bryan should have had the opportunity at being THE guy. There was no real reason not to go with him, beyond Vince's antiqued way of thinking what a star is. In today's climate, Bryan has a ton more crossover appeal and relatability than Reigns does, and he's a hell of a lot cooler. The point is, he was more over the last two years than most people who got the chance to be The Guy, but they never once seemed to be the least bit interested in testing the waters. As Meltzer said, people just really, really like Bryan. Why even question it? There is no logical reason I can think of, other than he's not the guy simply because he wasn't chosen to be the guy. But Reigns is not the guy.

 

I think much of what you're saying is subjective.  I won't say I disagree with certain points--but who's cool and relatable is based on personal perference, and not necessarily what a corporation may think when considering their bottom line.

 

Bryan isn't going to be the guy--no matter how much some wish it so.  Some feel Reigns is the wrong choice. So I'll pose this question:  Who is, and can that person be pushed high enough in the next 6-12 months for most to care?

[Patrick B.]

JBL accidentally referred to the I-C Title as a "belt".  I immediately got the mental picture of Vince McMahon throwing furniture backstage and yelling, SCREAMING into the headset for Cole to correct him and say it was a "championship".

[Brysynner]

Why not both? That's a bit of a problem with the whole there can be only One The Guy thing. But I agree with you that there should be larger than life characters, too. Is that Reigns? I don't think so. I do believe that the type of guy Bryan is (and Punk too) is what a lot of the audience gravitates towards today. And the mainstream media they so crave is seemingly the same. Those two guys have got them more mainstream press than anyone post-Cena. 

 

But what got them their press. Punk got press because his "contract ran out" while he was champion. Daniel Bryan got press because a university borrowed the Yes! chant and claimed they borrowed it from him. Then he got press because his local/favorite sports teams won championships (Seahawks/SF Giants), he beat up some jackasses trying to break into his house, and he befriended a dying boy.

 

You want Roman Reigns to get press, have something happen that's "not part of the show" something that's believable. I highly doubt anyone from Florida's gonna win a championship soon and for some reason I can't see Believe That taking off (but who knows stranger things have happened)

[JohnnyJ]

 

I think what people are upset about is that Bryan should have had the opportunity at being THE guy. There was no real reason not to go with him, beyond Vince's antiqued way of thinking what a star is. In today's climate, Bryan has a ton more crossover appeal and relatability than Reigns does, and he's a hell of a lot cooler. The point is, he was more over the last two years than most people who got the chance to be The Guy, but they never once seemed to be the least bit interested in testing the waters. As Meltzer said, people just really, really like Bryan. Why even question it? There is no logical reason I can think of, other than he's not the guy simply because he wasn't chosen to be the guy. But Reigns is not the guy.

 

I think much of what you're saying is subjective.  I won't say I disagree with certain points--but who's cool and relatable is based on personal perference, and not necessarily what a corporation may think when considering their bottom line.

 

Bryan isn't going to be the guy--no matter how much some wish it so.  Some feel Reigns is the wrong choice. So I'll pose this question:  Who is, and can that person be pushed high enough in the next 6-12 months for most to care?

 

 

Right now I'd say the answer is Rollins. He's over with the diehards and the office. 

[Go2Sleep]

I just realized the IC angle would be 100x better if they were feuding over the hardcore title instead. Ambrose, Harper, and Stardust are natural fits for that division, Barrett's the supposed tough guy straight-man who thinks he can beat all the crazy people, Truth's there because he's a jobber, Bryan voluntarily steps down because it's different and something to prove not because he just doesn't care about the important belt anymore, and Ziggler's there because... I don't know, you can't have a ladder match without the show off or something, who cares? Clusterfuck booking was part of the soul of the hardcore division. The title stealing would make sense because anarchy rules, and you just need one quick segment where HHH says "fuck this shit, you're all in a ladder match at Mania, hope that settles it, I'm out" to tie it all together. The matches would be something different to mix it up on a 3-hour show and the entire division could have some character beyond "we don't want to push these guys even though they're doing the same things as the guys we are pushing." You could really accentuate their insanity and make them stand out while keeping them entirely separate from the main event.