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[MM15] R1: JOHN CENA vs. HIROSHI TANAHASHI


JOHN CENA vs. HIROSHI TANAHASHI  

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POLL OPEN TILL SOMETIME MONDAY

 

JOHN CENA

vs. Seth Rollins - No DQ

http://youtu.be/53SqDwtsDlQ

(there are a variety of these up on Youtube. I just picked one but they are all about the same)

 

vs. Rusev

http://youtu.be/IvselHQkEBU

 

(Also see the Brock Lesnar poll. And a few other ones)

 

HIROSHI TANAHASHI

vs. Doc Gallows

http://rutube.ru/video/a62c8b9c19b4d5292d158d02e15057a8/?ref=search

 

(Also see several other polls.)

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Oh man. I know Dylan has got to be livid about that flub.

 

Cena is far better than Tanahashi and I don't hate Tanahashi quite as much as others.

 

The Lesnar matches alone are probably better than the Tanahashi matches I saw last year.

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So far, I've seen a lot of Tanahashi loathing going on (Dylan calling him a "fraud" is pretty funny). Could I get some actual criticisms of his work? I'm not his biggest fan, not by a long shot, but he had some great matches the past 12 months that blow Cena's top end stuff out of the water. I enjoy Cena the in-ring wrestler a great deal but sitting through his promos are a chore and I hate his character. He had a good year but not nearly his best.

 

Here are some of the reasons why I'm not Tanahashi's biggest fan: shitty strikes, lacks passion in the ring, shoddy psychology at times, inconsistent selling. What else am I missing? 

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My biggest issues with Tanahashi are the first two mentioned above. Cena's strikes are shit too, but at least he can be great at times emoting during a match. The biggest problem with Tanahashi's shitty strikes is that he has shitty strikes in New Japan where guys like Ishii, Shibata, Suzuki, and Nak work.

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Tanahashi would fit right in within WWE with all the finisher spamming and bad strikes.

 

Seriously, Cena had a year where outside of anything involving Brock Lesnar, he wasn't really that great. The Wyatt matches were abominations. The Orton match was whatever, but at this point, Cena/Orton and Tanahashi/Okada are both matchups that I just can't get excited about. The most recent Tanahashi/Okada match was likewise fine, but man, don't care at this point for whatever reason.

 

I don't know, I need to think about this. I genuinely like both of these guys, but neither had a year that really wowed me. I'll look at arguments in this thread. 

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I can't even pretend that Cena brings anything to the table at this point. He was the third wheel in Lesnar/Rollins, and that's about it this year. Same terrible submission where he gently hugs his opponent while yelling, same promos that end with JACK. The best thing he's done his year is get torn into by Stephanie McMahon. 

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Yeah, I see myself voting on this Sunday or Monday morning.  I've always been a Cena fan, but am put off by his goofy promos and shitty punches.  But the Lesnar matches are examples of how great he could be when it counts.  With Tanahashi my main gripes are his constant use of the HIgh Fly Flow.  If it's not meant to be a finisher, then why not have a finish that works?  The only matches I've seen from him  are against Okada and I loved those.  But I'm not aware of how he's been against other opponents.  Thanks to NJPW World I'm hoping to remedy that, but I'd like to see how he fares against mid-card guys and main eventers alike.

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Tanahashi is AR Fox with better hair and better booking. John Cena had his worst year since 2005 and he still blows Tanahashi out of the water. 

 

I'm pretty sure I'd pick Cena in an air guitar competition over Tanahashi.

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I will quote myself (douchebaggery!) from the main thread on why I feel like Tanahashi is better and why hitting multiple "finishers" in New Japan is nothing new.

 

 

I know that Tanahashi is a polarizing figure on here and that there's some backlash from the Meltzer dick riding but Tanahashi's year blows Cena's out of the water. There's the Okada match from January 4th, the Nakamura matches from April and August, the Shibata matches from July (G1) and September, the Ishii match from the G1, on top of pulling a very good match out of DBS. He had a bunch of great tag matches that built up single matches and had a pair of really good single matches with Styles (one from the G1 and the other from October). The volume of good-to-great matches he was in the past 12 months is ludicrous and while Cena had a strong year (not as strong as his previous two off the top of my head), there isn't much of an argument in my mind other than he's Cena and he's in WWE. Or that people outright hate Tanahashi for playing air guitar, having magnificent hair, and shitty strikes.

 

The complaint about him hitting too many high fly flows is fine, but it's the Japanese style that cumulative damage is the key rather than having a super death move that nobody kicks out of (unless we're talking AJPW/NOAH, which had both lines of thinking to their detriment). This goes back to Choshu throwing lariats out like their candy and it's Halloween every day he wrestled.

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Tanahashi is more consistent, but after seeing Cena carry Bray fucking Wyatt to a great WWE garbage match (and we're talking about my least favourite pro wrestling genre here) I have to go with him.

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I will quote myself (douchebaggery!) from the main thread on why I feel like Tanahashi is better and why hitting multiple "finishers" in New Japan is nothing new.

 

 

I know that Tanahashi is a polarizing figure on here and that there's some backlash from the Meltzer dick riding but Tanahashi's year blows Cena's out of the water. There's the Okada match from January 4th, the Nakamura matches from April and August, the Shibata matches from July (G1) and September, the Ishii match from the G1, on top of pulling a very good match out of DBS. He had a bunch of great tag matches that built up single matches and had a pair of really good single matches with Styles (one from the G1 and the other from October). The volume of good-to-great matches he was in the past 12 months is ludicrous and while Cena had a strong year (not as strong as his previous two off the top of my head), there isn't much of an argument in my mind other than he's Cena and he's in WWE. Or that people outright hate Tanahashi for playing air guitar, having magnificent hair, and shitty strikes.

 

The complaint about him hitting too many high fly flows is fine, but it's the Japanese style that cumulative damage is the key rather than having a super death move that nobody kicks out of (unless we're talking AJPW/NOAH, which had both lines of thinking to their detriment). This goes back to Choshu throwing lariats out like their candy and it's Halloween every day he wrestled.

I'm liking your post not for your post, but for your sig.

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I don't understand the hate either of these two get.  Neither is perfect, but no one is more suited for their respective main event styles.  Both guys are seemingly indestructable, both can have a good match with everyone on the roster, and both have carried their companies for years on end.  You might not like them, but who is really better equipped to be in their positions?

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I don't understand the hate either of these two get.  Neither is perfect, but no one is more suited for their respective main event styles.  Both guys are seemingly indestructable, both can have a good match with everyone on the roster, and both have carried their companies for years on end.  You might not like them, but who is really better equipped to be in their positions?

If Okada had lost, I would have an awesome retort for this: "Ultimo Guerrero and Dragon Lee"

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People who say Tanahashi has bad strikes always act as if it were self-evidently true. But what exactly is wrong with them? They don't look as impactful as Ishii and Shibata's? Well, no shit, those guys are blasting their opponents as hard as they can while Tanahashi is holding back somewhat. So who throws better worked strikes?

 

To be honest, I don't think Cena had any matches during the voting period I would consider great on their own merits, let alone better than Tanahashi's best.

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So far, I've seen a lot of Tanahashi loathing going on (Dylan calling him a "fraud" is pretty funny). Could I get some actual criticisms of his work? I'm not his biggest fan, not by a long shot, but he had some great matches the past 12 months that blow Cena's top end stuff out of the water. I enjoy Cena the in-ring wrestler a great deal but sitting through his promos are a chore and I hate his character. He had a good year but not nearly his best.

 

Here are some of the reasons why I'm not Tanahashi's biggest fan: shitty strikes, lacks passion in the ring, shoddy psychology at times, inconsistent selling. What else am I missing? 

 

I think Tanahashi is a really poor ace.  He is charismatic (though I don't think that charisma translates nearly as well outside of Japan FWIW), but he doesn't ever come across as "the man" to me.  Compare him to someone like Harashima who is a brilliant ace, or even Nakamura in his own promotion, and I think he's clearly several pegs below in that regard.  

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it's funny that the Cena storyline for the last month has been "CENA AGED OUT OF BEING ABLE TO HANG" cuz that's pretty much what I feel about Tanahashi.

2007-2009, Tanahashi was believably the best thing going in New Japan. 2010 on, it's kind of been Nakamura.

I ended up voting Cena cuz I can't remember a single Tanahashi match in the voting period where I was moved to more than "yeah okay"

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