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Fat Spanish Waiter

RAW AUGUST 5TH 2013

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That'd be an interesting gimmick.  High flyer who keeps missing on top-rope moves because he has a problem with depth perception, so he begrudgingly gets some awkward-looking goggles and starts nailing moves.  Someone's had to have done that on the indies, right?

 

They should do a wrestling version of this guy-

 

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He probably isn't a shit person but he probably isn't the do-no-wrong angel they constantly make him out to be either.  No one's that "good" of a person.

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Layla should call AJ "Michelle" even as AJ keeps trying to get over the name "LayJ"

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He probably isn't a shit person but he probably isn't the do-no-wrong angel they constantly make him out to be either.  No one's that "good" of a person.

He doesn't have much to do to be a better figure head than those that came before him.

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At least she's not a happy smiley diva babyface.She's crying at least 70% of the time.

FTFY

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He probably isn't a shit person but he probably isn't the do-no-wrong angel they constantly make him out to be either.  No one's that "good" of a person.

He doesn't have much to do to be a better figure head than those that came before him.

 

 

Yeah.  Beyond Snuka shit, I don't care or expect any entertainer to be a good person in order to enjoy their work.

 

And every time I do snoop around their lives, I end up liking their work less: From Carvaggio all the way to Dynamite Kid.  The whole goddamned history of people doing awesome things is populated by 100,00,000 X bigger assholes than (so far as anyone knows so far) John Cena.

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Finally got around to watching the whole thing.

 

First off, as much shit as we give WWE/Vince/the writers, how friggin' brilliant is this Cena-Bryan angle.  It's almost like Vince knew way back when he started calling it "sports entertainment" that at some point in the future someone would get way over by calling himself a "Wrestler".  So you've got Bryan calling himself a "Wrestler" denouncing John Cena, proclaiming his love of wrestling.  Then you've got John Cena coming out and calling out Bryan for celebrating his past accomplishments with a brilliant NFL/Arena Football analogy and saying that he loves the WWE.  Basically, you're running a smarks vs marks feud, and no one is the wiser that they're being worked.  The guys who go to shows and chant "You can't wrestle!" and bemoan the lack of push for Bryan are completely and utterly being worked and don't even realize it.  Then you throw in Vince, Stephanie, Triple H, add in the Randy Orton element, and the Shield as wildcards (FTR, well in advance of the PPV, here's my theory after Bryan-Cena, Shield comes out and beats the winner down, Orton cashes in MITB, eventually you get the reveal that Orton and the Shield work for Vince, and the Shield have ALWAYS worked for Vince, all the way back to last year).  It's pretty brilliant stuff.  I honestly don't remember the last time a main event program was worked so smartly and written so well.

 

Anyways

-RVD-ADR was fine.  ADR's post-match beatdown was AMAZING.  I don't know if this is the end of the line for Ricardo, but if it is, what a way to go out. That fall through the ropes was absolutely nasty.  And the bucket beatdown was perfect because Ricardo got his hand up for every shot, but it still looked good.

-Henry-Ryback need an actual match because what was going on looked terrific.  I dig the build-up of Ryback as high school bully who beats up the little guys and runs away from the big guys.  Presuming that Bryan is going back to the midcard after Summerslam (I saw today that he was booked to wrestle Fandango in September so what else should I expect?), I really want to see an angle where Ryback beats up Bryan, gets DQed, continues the beatdown until we get Henry's music and him standing up to the bully.  I think the right crowd would be molten for that.

-Wyatts-ToF was perfectly fine.  That said, he's been doing it for MONTHS now, how can Tensai still not figure out his pre-match dancing?!  I really want a 10+ minute Tensai-Harper match, they were just laying into each other and the slap exchange was awesome.  How long do you think WWE can keep Wyatts heel?  At this point, I think they might be face by Survivor Series.

-Kaitlyn-Layla was sorta awful.  Best part of the match was Michael Cole going "I have no idea" when asked what Layla was doing ziplining around the ring, then Lawler called it 'The Sloth' and JBL was totally mystified until Lawler explained it.  Then when Cole asked him if he'd ever seen anything like it before, JBL replied "Sure, Mutual of Omaha" which KILLED the announcing completely.  Match sucked a dick, quite frankly.  Someone better show Layla some old Lay-Cool matches, because I have no IDEA what she was going for here.  BTW, how screwed up is the diva booking when Kaitlyn, the only supposed face in the match whose been turned on and screwed over again and again, gets no reaction and AJ, the supposedly crazy heel who cheats, cries, turns on people (turns on, not turns ON), gets a monster pop every time.

-Fandango-Kofi was pretty shitty.  I don't hate Kofi as much as most on here, but he didn't look very good.  And I've been enjoying Fandango, so I gotta lay the blame on Kofi.

-Usos-Americans is something I completely forgot except for Uso 1 or 2's crazy reckless, almost-faceplanting dive.

-Big E.-Dolph was terrific.  Langston's clothesline is the bees' knees.  I wish they'd get him away from AJ, turn him face, and just have him do the "Gimme 5" from NXT.  I think the crowd could get way behind him mowing down midcard heels and Miz.

-Main event was too short to do much, but I enjoyed the booking.

 

Top 3 Performances

3. Brock Lesnar/Renee Young: Brock's "Paul, say something stupid line was enough to get him in here.  Young gets in here because of the way she kept slowly...slowly backing away from Heyman until by the end of the promo she was like three feet away holding the mic way away from her body.  I dunno if it was intentional, or Heyman just ate something gross but either way...awesome.

2. John Cena: He didn't wrestle, but that was a money promo no matter how you slice it, the way he shut down the antagonistic sections of the crowd, the way he subtly but not really heeled on Bryan.

1. Big E.: For those two clotheslines alone.  Seriously, though, he looked big, he sold well, he murdered Dolph repeatedly.  I'd like to put Dolph here for the bumping, but that Fame-Asser was awful.

 

Worst 3 Performances

3. the Fandango push: I miss it already.

2. Kofi Kingston: You're off for a couple months and you have all this time to come back and still miss Trouble in Paradise?!  Come on Kofi, I've defended you in the past but...you gotta help out a little.

1. Layla: Seriously bad stuff.  She's been playing milquetoast face diva model #4 for so long that I'll give her a bit of a pass but she delivered a shitty promo, a shitty match, and kinda whiffed on her finish.  And that sloth thing was...I dunno.  I really didn't wanna put another diva in here to not look like a total misogynist and had Kofi all ready for this spot, then I saw the Layla match.  So, sorry ladies, maybe next week.

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Re: Cena

 

I would consider myself more of a "Batman guy" than a "Superman guy", if that explains things.  The appeal of Batman is seeing how he uses his head to figure out a way to win.  Most of the time, Superman wins because...he's Superman.

 

Maybe Cena's a legitimately good guy; that's fine.  He's not there for fans like me; he's there for the kids to be an "infallible" hero.  I haven't been in the "target audience" for a very long time.

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Is Ricardo going to disappear (future endeavored?), join someone else, become an active wrestler (the cheaper, Mexican equivalent of A-Ry?), or go crawling back to ADR?

 

He had been working house shows in his Chimera gimmick as "el Local". It would be pretty easy for them to use that gimmick and have everyone "know" it's Ricardo under there but never say it. Or lampshade it. Whatever. Either way, I'd like to see it, because he's a decent luchadore.

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He did El Local on Saturday Morning Slam and I think even NXT a few times. I always thought it would be a good angle to have him disappear as Ricardo, come back as "new wrestler" El Local after a few weeks, start getting better and better and begin winning more matches, then eventually end up in a "throwaway" match with del Rio on Smackdown after a few weeks/months, beat him, then unmask to a monster pop.

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First off, as much shit as we give WWE/Vince/the writers, how friggin' brilliant is this Cena-Bryan angle.  It's almost like Vince knew way back when he started calling it "sports entertainment" that at some point in the future someone would get way over by calling himself a "Wrestler".  So you've got Bryan calling himself a "Wrestler" denouncing John Cena, proclaiming his love of wrestling.  Then you've got John Cena coming out and calling out Bryan for celebrating his past accomplishments with a brilliant NFL/Arena Football analogy and saying that he loves the WWE.  Basically, you're running a smarks vs marks feud, and no one is the wiser that they're being worked.  The guys who go to shows and chant "You can't wrestle!" and bemoan the lack of push for Bryan are completely and utterly being worked and don't even realize it.  Then you throw in Vince, Stephanie, Triple H, add in the Randy Orton element, and the Shield as wildcards (FTR, well in advance of the PPV, here's my theory after Bryan-Cena, Shield comes out and beats the winner down, Orton cashes in MITB, eventually you get the reveal that Orton and the Shield work for Vince, and the Shield have ALWAYS worked for Vince, all the way back to last year).  It's pretty brilliant stuff.  I honestly don't remember the last time a main event program was worked so smartly and written so well.

 

Wasn't Vince the one that revealed the Shield worked for Heyman and was going to fire him for it? I don't necessarily think they need to need to say the Shield always worked for Vince especially when Vince was against Punk using the Shield during his title run. But I do think the angle will have Shield and Orton/Vince in cahoots after Monday's angle. Orton is so boring right now I think he needs the Shield to bring the excitement factor to any WWE Title run he gets. Vince, Orton and the Shield as the Corporation/Corporate Legacy sounds way more interesting than just a Vince/Orton pairing. The idea of DB/Cena/Henry/HHH vs. Orton in the Shield Survivor Series Elimination Match is fantastic.

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HHH being pissed at Vince for aligning with the guy who once attacked his wife would be a potential angle.

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Re: Cena

 

I would consider myself more of a "Batman guy" than a "Superman guy", if that explains things.  The appeal of Batman is seeing how he uses his head to figure out a way to win.  Most of the time, Superman wins because...he's Superman.

 

 

 

This is a basic problem with wrestling heel/face logic.  Every time someone turns face (apparently with the exception of Dolph Ziggler) they gain some superpowers or super-ability-to-kick-out.  Especially the top babyfaces.  They've been Supermen for a long time.  You become a face, you get some kind fo Hulk-up powerup. Turning face is like taking a PED.

 

Meanwhile the heels are fallible, and so have to work harder and be more cunning.  But given this, wouldn't "turning face" be the ultimate heel move?  You suddenly get this huge advantage you didn't have before (super-heart?).  I think that's why a lot of smarks cheer heels.  There's a way in which the Faces, if they are kayfabe-conscious, are pulling off a scam that makes them the ultimate heels...and a heel who doesn't exploit that becomes somehow enobled by not taking the easy way out.

 

I know it's mixing kayfabe logic and non-kayfabe logic...but it's hard not to nowadays when guys like Cena and Punk want their character to be an extension of their backstage image.

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I'd argue that monsters like Kane or Big Show lose superpowers whenever they turn face. Instead of being able to tank a million finishers or set people on fire, they suddenly lose those abilities in favor of being cheered for being massive bullies.

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First off, as much shit as we give WWE/Vince/the writers, how friggin' brilliant is this Cena-Bryan angle.  It's almost like Vince knew way back when he started calling it "sports entertainment" that at some point in the future someone would get way over by calling himself a "Wrestler".  So you've got Bryan calling himself a "Wrestler" denouncing John Cena, proclaiming his love of wrestling.  Then you've got John Cena coming out and calling out Bryan for celebrating his past accomplishments with a brilliant NFL/Arena Football analogy and saying that he loves the WWE.  Basically, you're running a smarks vs marks feud, and no one is the wiser that they're being worked.  The guys who go to shows and chant "You can't wrestle!" and bemoan the lack of push for Bryan are completely and utterly being worked and don't even realize it.  Then you throw in Vince, Stephanie, Triple H, add in the Randy Orton element, and the Shield as wildcards (FTR, well in advance of the PPV, here's my theory after Bryan-Cena, Shield comes out and beats the winner down, Orton cashes in MITB, eventually you get the reveal that Orton and the Shield work for Vince, and the Shield have ALWAYS worked for Vince, all the way back to last year).  It's pretty brilliant stuff.  I honestly don't remember the last time a main event program was worked so smartly and written so well.

 

Wasn't Vince the one that revealed the Shield worked for Heyman and was going to fire him for it? I don't necessarily think they need to need to say the Shield always worked for Vince especially when Vince was against Punk using the Shield during his title run. But I do think the angle will have Shield and Orton/Vince in cahoots after Monday's angle. Orton is so boring right now I think he needs the Shield to bring the excitement factor to any WWE Title run he gets. Vince, Orton and the Shield as the Corporation/Corporate Legacy sounds way more interesting than just a Vince/Orton pairing. The idea of DB/Cena/Henry/HHH vs. Orton in the Shield Survivor Series Elimination Match is fantastic.

 

I wouldn't be surprised to see Vince conveniently leave that whole part out, or just say it was part of a bigger plot.  But, he could have just recently aligned with The Shield, you're right.

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I'd really hate to see The Shield become the grunts for a larger stable. Even though they haven't been featured as prominently recently, they've still been pretty protected. They have what, 5 total losses in the last 10 months or so? If they team up with Orton and Vince, guess who gets to start being the guys faces always beat up while the stable leaders run away...

 

And what happened to Brad Maddox this week? I thought his gimmick where he was stuck between 3 different people telling him what to do was brilliant and he was pulling it off expertly. Now, it seems like they've just cut him out of the picture and are putting Vince and HHH front and center, which is lame. 

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I'd argue that monsters like Kane or Big Show lose superpowers whenever they turn face. Instead of being able to tank a million finishers or set people on fire, they suddenly lose those abilities in favor of being cheered for being massive bullies.

 

 

Good point.  Some gain the power of Love...which sucks as a power donit?

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A heel-turned-face has to trade 50 IQ points to get their "superpower" though, and unless you're at Cena's level, someone else's music playing while you're trying to wrestle is pretty shitty kryptonite.

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That Ricardo/Del Rio angle wouldn't work because you'd have dumbass fans chanting "RI-CAR-DO" every time. Definitely not Ciclope unmasking as Dean Malenko potential with that happening.

 

Not a lot of great wrestling on here but the angles and mic work were good. I was kind of half paying attention to it mostly though, in addition to the channel flipping with all the other wrestling on, so I'm not best equipped to comment. Pissed that I missed the Wyatt Family match. Ricardo deserves a pay raise.

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Re: CenaI would consider myself more of a "Batman guy" than a "Superman guy", if that explains things. The appeal of Batman is seeing how he uses his head to figure out a way to win. Most of the time, Superman wins because...he's Superman.Maybe Cena's a legitimately good guy; that's fine. He's not there for fans like me; he's there for the kids to be an "infallible" hero. I haven't been in the "target audience" for a very long time.

I've known you for years and you've seemed to stop enjoying wrestling a long, long time ago. I haven't seen you say anything positive about it since we met.

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Re: Cena

 

I would consider myself more of a "Batman guy" than a "Superman guy", if that explains things.  The appeal of Batman is seeing how he uses his head to figure out a way to win.  Most of the time, Superman wins because...he's Superman.

 

Maybe Cena's a legitimately good guy; that's fine.  He's not there for fans like me; he's there for the kids to be an "infallible" hero.  I haven't been in the "target audience" for a very long time.

With the way he's been written the last 15+ years, you could pretty much say the same about Bats, too.

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Re: CenaI would consider myself more of a "Batman guy" than a "Superman guy", if that explains things. The appeal of Batman is seeing how he uses his head to figure out a way to win. Most of the time, Superman wins because...he's Superman.Maybe Cena's a legitimately good guy; that's fine. He's not there for fans like me; he's there for the kids to be an "infallible" hero. I haven't been in the "target audience" for a very long time.

I've known you for years and you've seemed to stop enjoying wrestling a long, long time ago. I haven't seen you say anything positive about it since we met.

 

 

There's plenty I enjoy.  I'm just particularly cautious since, as someone else said in this thread or another one, I've seen plenty of good angles/pushes go south.

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I'm still shocked that people are missing the boat with what they've been doing with Cena for YEARS.

 

He is not there to be the Superman, white-meat babyface. That is not his function and that is not how he is usually booked. People who complain about Cena playing that role are being worked. Cena has been used as a way to split crowd reaction and generate controversy or excitement with the bigger crowds they run PPVs for. They even mention it on commentary ALL THE TIME how Cena is the most Controversial champion in history.

 

He's there so you can throw faces or heels at him and still get good, strong reactions regardless. In order to keep the crowd split, his character has to stay the same. And for good reason, there is a lot of money in it. Cena matches seem like a big deal almost every time out specially because they expect the "smart" fans to boo him and the kids/women/unjaded to cheer him. If you don't think that reaction is planned and cultivated very carefully then you are deluding yourself.

 

Cena is the greatest "tweener" of all time.

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Re: Cena

 

I would consider myself more of a "Batman guy" than a "Superman guy", if that explains things.  The appeal of Batman is seeing how he uses his head to figure out a way to win.  Most of the time, Superman wins because...he's Superman.

 

 

 

This is a basic problem with wrestling heel/face logic.  Every time someone turns face (apparently with the exception of Dolph Ziggler) they gain some superpowers or super-ability-to-kick-out.  Especially the top babyfaces.  They've been Supermen for a long time.  You become a face, you get some kind fo Hulk-up powerup. Turning face is like taking a PED.

 

Meanwhile the heels are fallible, and so have to work harder and be more cunning.  But given this, wouldn't "turning face" be the ultimate heel move?  You suddenly get this huge advantage you didn't have before (super-heart?).  I think that's why a lot of smarks cheer heels.  There's a way in which the Faces, if they are kayfabe-conscious, are pulling off a scam that makes them the ultimate heels...and a heel who doesn't exploit that becomes somehow enobled by not taking the easy way out.

 

I know it's mixing kayfabe logic and non-kayfabe logic...but it's hard not to nowadays when guys like Cena and Punk want their character to be an extension of their backstage image.

 

 

I was thinking something like this the other day when I was watching Chuck Klosterman talk about his new book, which is about evil in popular culture. Part of it is about why people feel drawn to villains.

 

One thing he pointed out was that actors always say the villain roles are more "interesting" but he thinks what they really mean is that those characters are more real. They are flawed and human.

 

I think this absolutely applies to wrestling. The traditional super hero character (Cena or Hogan being the obvious examples) aren't real human beings. We're not perfectly moral and we don't always do the right thing. We're complicated. Randy Savage was fascinating, a ball of energy and neuroses and excitement. CM Punk is thoughtful and principled and stubborn. They're great characters, in a way that Hogan and Cena are not. 

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