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odessasteps

By odessasteps
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Eivion

Eivion

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2 hours ago, The Unholy Dragon said:

 

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In the Marvel Universe, the Axis won WWII with Hydra's help and Steve Rogers as Hydra Cap only for the Allies to make the first Cosmic Cube which they used to reverse the results of the war. So Kobik making Steve loyal to Hydra restored the Steve from the unaltered timeline which is why his idea of Hydra and loyalty was different than what the Red Skull intended.

 

But yeah, the tl;dr is that Hydra Steve is actually the 'original' from before the Allies used a Cosmic Cube do-over to reverse losing WWII which...it's an interesting concept, but I can't imagine it becomes a lasting canon people use.

 


That is an interesting concept for a What If? or general alternate universe comic, but yeah that definitely seems like something that would just piss people off as far as the main line goes. As far as them making it a lasting cannon, they shouldn't, but we really are at a never say never point with Marvel.

 

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The Unholy Dragon

The Unholy Dragon

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4 hours ago, odessasteps said:

Technically, didnt Secret Wars re-write history anyway? 

Yeah. And it's been a running thing for like three or four years now that time is messed up in the MCU, like how they're doing a thing where the original X-Men were maybe 10 years ago but also the 1960s. It's hitting Night Vale levels of 'time is weird' but with no evidence of resolution forthcoming.

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J.H.

J.H.

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1 hour ago, The Unholy Dragon said:

Yeah. And it's been a running thing for like three or four years now that time is messed up in the MCU, like how they're doing a thing where the original X-Men were maybe 10 years ago but also the 1960s. It's hitting Night Vale levels of 'time is weird' but with no evidence of resolution forthcoming.

Well now you made me realize how quickly I'd read an X-Men/Night Vale crossover

James

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odessasteps

odessasteps

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Winter Palace Pod 59 - The Royal Flush Gang
 
Today on the show, writer Al Ewing (@Al_Ewing) stops by for a wide-ranging chat about his work. First, we discuss his current work at Marvel, including the recently-launched Inhumans book Royals, including the book's creation, it's outer space setting, the inclusion of Noh-Varr and more. We also chat about his other current books Ultimates and US Avengers, and their predecessors, New Avengers, Mighty Avengers and Contest of Champions. Lots of fun stuff for you here, including the joy of C-list villains, serious vs fun superhero books and we even discuss Iso-8, the MacGuffin Mineral that features throughout Marvel's comics and video games.
 
Then, we chat about Doctor Who in a number of forms. We mention the "Doctor What" story in 2000AD done by Al and Brendan McCarthy, as well as the Matt Smith Era Doctor Who comics Al wrote for Titan. We also discuss the current season (following the season premiere), Peter Capaldi's performance as the Doctor and more.
 
Finally, we go on a bunch of tangents and have a long chat about UK and US television, everything from World of Sport to Gladiators to The Great British Bake Off to QI and lots more. If you are a fan of British Comedy, there's a lot of it mentioned, including Whose Line Is It Anyway, Blackadder, The Young Ones, Dad's Army, Morecambe and Wise, Fry and Laurie, but no French and Saunders.
 
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The Natural

The Natural

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On 4/21/2017 at 10:45 PM, The Unholy Dragon said:

 

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In the Marvel Universe, the Axis won WWII with Hydra's help and Steve Rogers as Hydra Cap only for the Allies to make the first Cosmic Cube which they used to reverse the results of the war. So Kobik making Steve loyal to Hydra restored the Steve from the unaltered timeline which is why his idea of Hydra and loyalty was different than what the Red Skull intended.

 

But yeah, the tl;dr is that Hydra Steve is actually the 'original' from before the Allies used a Cosmic Cube do-over to reverse losing WWII which...it's an interesting concept, but I can't imagine it becomes a lasting canon people use.

 

 

On 4/21/2017 at 10:53 PM, Horton Hears a Wooo!!! said:

Edit: Unholy Dragon posted while I was typing.

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I actually love the idea.  I've gotten used to wacky ideas to temporarily replace heroes - Doc Ock is Peter Parker's body, for example - but this is really, really out there.  The idea is that Steve was always supposed to be a Hydra loyalist and Kobirk merely undid the first Cube's tinkering.

The bigger implication is almost all of the Marvel U's history is false and everyone should have lived in a Nazi paradise for the past 70 years.

I'm really curious to see where this goes.  It will be trippy if they run with this idea.

 

Didn't expect that. Thanks.

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The Natural

The Natural

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Steve Rogers: Captain America, Hail HYDRA collects material from Free Comic Book Day 2016 Steve Rogers: Captain America and Steve Rogers: Captain America #1-6 by Nick Spencer. The revelation in Steve Rogers: Captain America #1, Captain America is fighting for HYDRA was and still is controversial. The book is set in the present as Steve Rogers works for HYDRA’s cause and the past showing how HYDRA recruited his Mum and him.

As noted this brought controversy. I understand why as it’s such a difference to what the character is/stands for. HYDRA Cap. The longest double agent ever with thick heroes not picking up on it and Mjolnir is a poor choice of character too ; ).

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The Unholy Dragon

The Unholy Dragon

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9 hours ago, The Natural said:

HYDRA Cap. The longest double agent ever with thick heroes not picking up on it...

So Secret Empire #0 addresses this:

 

Hydra Cap is the Cap from the timeline where the Nazis won WWII dropped in the body of classic Cap and also having his memories. So Kobik didn't change his history as much as his memory of that history. But it was finally cleared up that his history in this timeline was unchanged and basically he just had the different personality swapped in.

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APO

APO

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Man, who knew that Cap coming off a bit fascist during the eternally awful AvX would end up prophetic? :lol:

Seriously though, while I'm not planning on buying this or any Marvel event in the near future... this seems like something not even Rogers can truly come back from. Spencer may give the ol' college try, but I'm not really seeing how this ends without Rogers' name forever tarnished and/or his death.  

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The Natural

The Natural

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17 hours ago, Eivion said:

Heh, I thought you made that comment because you had heard about it already.

I honestly didn't. Great timing.
 

16 hours ago, The Unholy Dragon said:

So Secret Empire #0 addresses this:

 

 

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Hydra Cap is the Cap from the timeline where the Nazis won WWII dropped in the body of classic Cap and also having his memories. So Kobik didn't change his history as much as his memory of that history. But it was finally cleared up that his history in this timeline was unchanged and basically he just had the different personality swapped in.

 

Thank you.

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Matt D

Matt D

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5 hours ago, APO said:

Man, who knew that Cap coming off a bit fascist during the eternally awful AvX would end up prophetic? :lol:

Seriously though, while I'm not planning on buying this or any Marvel event in the near future... this seems like something not even Rogers can truly come back from. Spencer may give the ol' college try, but I'm not really seeing how this ends without Rogers' name forever tarnished and/or his death.  

I'm seeing this as an AzBats/Spider-Ock thing, myself. They've pretty much gone out of their way now to express that this is a different Steve who had different experiences growing up and an entirely different origin story. It'd be like redoing Peter Parker's origin where he was secretly adopted by Norman Osborn after his parents were killed or something. It's much more of a Red Son thing than something that he has to come back from. At some point, reality will go back to where this lady never recruited Steve's mother into Hydra when he was a kid and that's that. I'd actually be really surprised if we don't see Hydra Cap fighting our Cap in a story within 5 years or so. They'd be sort of crazy NOT to do that at this point.

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