Petey Posted June 29, 2014 Share Posted June 29, 2014 It's the same thing. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tromatagon Posted June 29, 2014 Share Posted June 29, 2014 Naw dog, naw Long Island never brought us the fucking Toxic Avenger 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ultimoDANK Posted June 29, 2014 Share Posted June 29, 2014 I'd keep arguing, but there's some serious goalpost moving and irrational hate going on to continue. And I don't even really like Ryder that much, but the reasons given for hate are ridiculous. There is nothing irrational or ridiculous about my hate. It's an annoying character and he's abominable in the ring. It's not like he's green either, he's had nearly 900 matches. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ebbie Posted June 29, 2014 Share Posted June 29, 2014 So, speaking of deserved pushes and not, let's change the topic from some fucking jobber who shouldn't have a name at this point to a guy that the WWE has tries really, really hard to make into a big deal.. Â Â What does Orton bring to the table that anyone else on the roster couldn't? Total Divas pretended that DB's Little Engine that Could story ended at Summerslam. When in reality, he came to a brick wall because they wanted to push Orton over him. Why? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cool arrow Posted June 29, 2014 Share Posted June 29, 2014 I don't get Vince's hardon for Orton either. He's tall and muscular sure, but he lacks true hossness. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Petey Posted June 29, 2014 Share Posted June 29, 2014 It's because he's an OR TIN. Â I really don't know. Sure, he's got the look, but I've never found him to be anything great on the mic and lacking ring presence and overall in-ring skill. The only time I felt like he got legitimately over as THE guy was his tweener period where the crowd just started going bonkers for him. Â That's not to say he hasn't had good matches or anything because it's happened. But I've always felt he's been really mediocre for most of his career and never deserving of the constant push. As stated above, I think they could have plugged a lot of other guys into the role and had better success. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greggulator Posted June 29, 2014 Share Posted June 29, 2014 Randy is a really interesting performer. Randy as young teen heartthrob? Terrible. Randy as entitled young Evolution member? Pretty awesome in a ton of ways -- I really have to rewatch that crazy match with Foley where they did all those great fake negative political ads. Randy having blackouts and kicking Vince and Cena's dad in the skull? Awesome. Randy as entitled brat in The Authority? Terrific. He has carried the promotion at a few different times. He wrestles well as a heel, has a great finisher, can do some good promos, etc. Randy as a face during those in between spots? Awful. Face Randy is absolutely awful and a total snooze. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt D Posted June 29, 2014 Share Posted June 29, 2014 Ryder had the gimmick in ECW right when Jersey Shore was pretty hot, which meant it was about five years too early for WWE. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goodear Posted June 29, 2014 Share Posted June 29, 2014 That was kind of the pinnacle of the gimmick to me when he had Rosa with him (and they, no lie, actually had chemistry) and he was the 'ECW Innovator of Super Hero' or something coming off 'retiring' Tommy Dreamer and beating Hurricane. Â I think the best moment was when Rosa just climbed in the ring once to show him her phone for no damn reason. Â Like she was totally oblivious as to what was going on and it was pretty awesome. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Nature Boy Posted June 29, 2014 Share Posted June 29, 2014 I'm probably alone but I actually liked Ryder more during his ECW run than during his RAW/internet hero run. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ultimoDANK Posted June 29, 2014 Share Posted June 29, 2014 I think Orton is good on his own and great when paired with a better worker. The problem with him is that we're all just so tired of him. He's been heavily featured both most of the last 10 years. He's a guy who would benefit from the WWE having a working relationship with foreign companies. Imagine if after Wrestlemania he could have left for a couple tours of NJPW or CMLL? Then take a month or 2 off and he comes back somewhat fresh with a story of what he's been upto. I have far-fetched hopes that under HHH the WWE can start thinking more globally. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JRGoldman Posted June 29, 2014 Share Posted June 29, 2014 If you went to a WWE live show from 2007 through 2012 or so, there was no one as over as Orton because he got uniform reactions as opposed to Cena's mixed ones. There have also been periods during which he has been one of the better workers on the roster. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ebbie Posted June 29, 2014 Share Posted June 29, 2014 Is also one of the most protected guys like EVER. When is the last time the RKO got kicked out of? There was a long period in which he ended every segment/match with an RKO as well. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Just Dave Posted June 29, 2014 Share Posted June 29, 2014 I'm probably alone but I actually liked Ryder more during his ECW run than during his RAW/internet hero run. You're not alone. At all. I've been watching through that 2009 ECW run on hulu and he's fantastic as cocky Guido douchebag heel. He was having good to great matches pretty much weekly with guys like Shelton Benjamin, Tommy Dreamer, Goldust, Christian, et al.  At some point somebody saw something in the guy. I just wonder what happened to change that. And don't say, "oh they just realized he sucked." That's a cop-out. Also, I'm not sure he or any other talent who has a low quarter hour is ever completely to blame for the low rating. I'm not saying there isn't any correlation ever, but blaming a talent for a low quarter hour is like saying Nathan Fillion sucked because Firefly got cancelled. There are too many other factors in play.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rehabilitated Rick Posted June 29, 2014 Share Posted June 29, 2014 Randy as a face is pretty dull sure, but I can't think off of the top of the dome anyone who had a better year than him match quality wise than his 2011 run, especially his Smackdown matches ironically when he was a face. Greg's summary of Orton is pretty accurate. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dolfan in NYC Posted June 29, 2014 Share Posted June 29, 2014 Just saw Darren Young in the NYC Gay Pride Parade. Awesome. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dolfan in NYC Posted June 29, 2014 Share Posted June 29, 2014 Just saw Darren Young in the NYC Gay Pride Parade. Awesome. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryan Posted June 29, 2014 Share Posted June 29, 2014 Was he on crutches? That knee surgery wasn't that long ago. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonnyLaw Posted June 29, 2014 Share Posted June 29, 2014 The Major Brothers' gimmick in ECW? They were huge old school ECW fans. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Niners Fan in CT Posted June 29, 2014 Share Posted June 29, 2014 I think Money in the Bank will be a good show.. I know RAW can suck the life out of you sometimes but the PPVs are always at least decent. The roster is too good now for there not to be a couple good or great matches. I'm going to RAW on Monday. Hopefully its a good show being that its post-mitb. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RandomAct Posted June 29, 2014 Share Posted June 29, 2014 My prediction is that I'll make it 3 matches in like the last show and start playing NBA 2K instead. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Fresh Posted June 29, 2014 Share Posted June 29, 2014 1. What do people see in Zack Ryder? That he gave a fuck. Which was surprisingly rare in WWE's midcard. He's not the best, but he clearly tried his ass off (for awhile) and that was endearing. 2. What is there to see in Randy Orton? Ever watch a Randy segment with a girl in her 20's? See how she reacts to Randy? That's what they see. Plus, when he's on, he's an all-time great. Right before Wrestlemania 25, he had a window where he could have honestly usurped Cena. Didn't happen, but was still great. I wish they had kept the IED gimmick. 3. Who doesn't text? If someone actually called my cell phone besides my parents, I'd never talk to them again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Fresh Posted June 29, 2014 Share Posted June 29, 2014 My prediction is that I'll make it 3 matches in like the last show and start playing NBA 2K instead. Do you have the Network? If so, you don't have to watch it live. Wait until the show is over, and see if any of us here say there's a few matches worth seeing and just watch those. There's two clusterfuck ladder matches, which are always worth seeing, even if they aren't great. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Petey Posted June 29, 2014 Share Posted June 29, 2014 I think Orton is good on his own and great when paired with a better worker. The problem with him is that we're all just so tired of him. He's been heavily featured both most of the last 10 years. He's a guy who would benefit from the WWE having a working relationship with foreign companies. Imagine if after Wrestlemania he could have left for a couple tours of NJPW or CMLL? Then take a month or 2 off and he comes back somewhat fresh with a story of what he's been upto. I have far-fetched hopes that under HHH the WWE can start thinking more globally. 100% this. In an era where guys can no longer go in and out of territories in order to stay fresh and learn new tricks of the trade, I think doing overseas tours with different promotions would benefit everyone. The touring wrestlers' characters would be able to stay fresh, they might become more well rounded as wrestlers, whatever region they tour in would gain a popularity boost and WWE would be able to showcase new talent with the newly freed on-air time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnnyJ Posted June 29, 2014 Share Posted June 29, 2014 Randy has been a long term above average hand with a main event look. In times when the main event scene is stacked with good performers (like now) he looks overrated and when the main event scene is barren he looks underrated. Right now he's in no mans land. His heel turn was ill conceived and the crowd has acted accordingly. I honestly couldn't tell you what his character is. Is he supposed to be a killer, a suck up or an underachiever? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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