BurningBeard Posted June 27, 2014 Share Posted June 27, 2014 Well this is kind of depressing: On the locker room reaction to Zack Ryder's depush: "The worst part of that whole thing is that it really kind of broke the spirit of the locker room. For years, we were told in all these pep talks that there's a brass ring, you've gotta reach for it and it's there for the taking if you work hard enough and get yourself over. And he did it; he defied the odds and actually does it, and all the boys are rooting for him, like "Oh wow, this is cool as sh*t. This has never been done before." He got over without the office, without TV time. It was pretty mind-blowing. And then they did just crush it and take it all away from him. To me, I felt the example that set for the rest of the boys was pretty brutal, because then it's like it almost feels hopeless. It's like, you're not going to get pushed unless they pick you to get pushed, and that's kind of it. I thought, above all, that message they sent to the boys was the worst part. They crushed the spirits of a lot of people, like "Okay, so my hard work here isn't going to pay off, huh?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Playa Shunna Ver 3.0 Posted June 27, 2014 Share Posted June 27, 2014 Ehh..it's only Zack Ryder. Seriously though, it is a horrible mixed message. Who is the quote attributed to? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rovert Posted June 27, 2014 Share Posted June 27, 2014 Ehh..it's only Zack Ryder. Seriously though, it is a horrible mixed message. Who is the quote attributed to? Curt Hawkins on the LAW radio show. Only Zack Ryder doesn't really matter still showed the locker room there's limited scope for self determination. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mco543 Posted June 27, 2014 Share Posted June 27, 2014 Ryder got a push, it didn't work, he's positioned where he should be. There is a ton of talent over the years that WWE has missed the boat on or wasted but Ryder, however, is not on that list. Ryder got a substantially better push and bigger opportunity than a lot of people who were a lot more deserving. It's the quote from Caddyshack "well, the world needs ditch diggers too". Coming from Hawkins though it seems like it's a highly questionable opinion since he's biased and Ryder is his boy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StretchMediatedHypertrophy Posted June 27, 2014 Share Posted June 27, 2014 Zack didn't draw ratings, but he shifted merch okay - and that's pretty key. They didn't have to bury him quite as much as he did. That's more the wider problem of essentially being a jobber unless you're on a push. The point about the message it sends the locker room is valid, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cristobal Posted June 27, 2014 Share Posted June 27, 2014 He didn't get MUCH of a push. They put the US title on him, then made him into the bitch in the Cena/Kane/Eve clusterfuck, and after that, the push vanished. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StretchMediatedHypertrophy Posted June 27, 2014 Share Posted June 27, 2014 He didn't get MUCH of a push. They put the US title on him, then made him into the bitch in the Cena/Kane/Eve clusterfuck, and after that, the push vanished. His segments tanked - but they could have been 'Sorry Zack, it looks like your act isn't good for ratings, But you have fans and sell merch, so we'll keep you strong on Superstars and on house shows and we can all think about how we might turn the rating issue around in a few months'. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spontaneous Posted June 27, 2014 Share Posted June 27, 2014 He did get brutally crushed. He could have gotten a decent US title run and seen how he continued to do with the fans, instead he got fed to Kane so Cena could have something to do before The Rock showed up. Yeah, it is only Zack Ryder, he probably wasn't the next megastar but no one is getting over except a designated few under the current model. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Go2Sleep Posted June 27, 2014 Share Posted June 27, 2014 I'm kind of curious what type of push "the locker room" expected for Ryder. I think most people would agree they could do more with him than they are now (or have been for the last 2+ years), but realistically, the guy's ceiling is face Miz. He's definitely not a guy that can be champ forever and ever no matter how much you respect him getting himself over. They probably should've looked to put him in tag team (Santino doesn't count) or at least kept him strong on the B-shows like someone else said so he could at least be an occasional IC/US champ. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nofuture Posted June 27, 2014 Share Posted June 27, 2014 Let's not forget that on some podcast Mick Foley said that Ryder never went to Vince directly in regard to his character/career. You gotta remember that getting over by yourself is fine, but without getting over with Vince, you're not going to get far. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cwoy2j Posted June 27, 2014 Share Posted June 27, 2014 I'm kind of curious what type of push "the locker room" expected for Ryder. I think most people would agree they could do more with him than they are now (or have been for the last 2+ years), but realistically, the guy's ceiling is face Miz. He's definitely not a guy that can be champ forever and ever no matter how much you respect him getting himself over. They probably should've looked to put him in tag team (Santino doesn't count) or at least kept him strong on the B-shows like someone else said so he could at least be an occasional IC/US champ. I don't think anyone was calling for the guy to be world champ but like you said, a midcard mainstay and not being made to look like an f'n doofus every week shouldn't be too much to ask. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LooseCannon Posted June 27, 2014 Share Posted June 27, 2014 I'm kind of curious what type of push "the locker room" expected for Ryder. I think most people would agree they could do more with him than they are now (or have been for the last 2+ years), but realistically, the guy's ceiling is face Miz. If his ceiling is face Miz, does that mean he can main event Wrestlemania? I don't see a problem with feeding Ryder to Kane in a build to Kane/Cena. I'd argue they should have kept Ryder as Cena's little buddy who gets dragged into any feud where Cena needs a tag partner. Imagine how Cena feuding with the Wyatts could have been improved and extended if it involved Bray Wyatt trying to get Ryder to turn on Cena. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
piranesi Posted June 27, 2014 Share Posted June 27, 2014 Let's not forget that on some podcast Mick Foley said that Ryder never went to Vince directly in regard to his character/career. You gotta remember that getting over by yourself is fine, but without getting over with Vince, you're not going to get far.There is something to this. Everyone's acting like Ryder played the game so well and so it's not fair that he didn't get his push. But the game is whatever works. His failure means he missed some aspect of it. and cultivating Vince May be the missing part. If you play the game of thrones you win or you do comedy segments on the Jbl and Cole show. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Victator Posted June 27, 2014 Share Posted June 27, 2014 The Wyatts kidnap Ryder is a version of the Oh'Henry story. He is returned hours later with Bray muttering "Take care, spike your hair." over and over. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnnyJ Posted June 27, 2014 Share Posted June 27, 2014 There are two points that are missed when people talk about Ryder: 1. I attended two events in the NYC area during the fall/winter of 2011. Ryder was unquestionably the 2nd most over guy on the roster after Punk. His merchandise was all over place and lines of people were whoo whooing at the concession stands. I know it's anecdotal, but when you're that over int he New York market there is plenty of money to be made. 2. Everyone cites to the failed attempt to push Ryder as evidence that he deserves his current position. Ryder was an internet phenomenon. All they had to do with him was keep the fans wanting more and protect him. Instead they threw him out there when only a small percentage of the fans were even aware that he existed, overexposed him and watched him fail. Then suddenly a guy who couldn't even get on tv as a jtts was mercilessly jobbed out until he no longer got a reaction. If he failed and they took him off tv it would be one thing. What they did to Ryder was something different. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mattdangerously Posted June 27, 2014 Share Posted June 27, 2014 No, they put him on TV and he showed everyone why he wasn't getting pushed in the first place: He isn't all that good. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cwoy2j Posted June 27, 2014 Share Posted June 27, 2014 No, they put him on TV and he showed everyone why he wasn't getting pushed in the first place: He isn't all that good. He's not that good at losing the title he worked hard to get within two weeks of getting it, getting his g/f stolen, changing tires, getting pushed off a stage in a wheelchair by Kane and then getting his ass kicked at every turn. I'm not a huge fan of the guy or anything but how can you expect anyone to get over when you book them to look like that? It's a self-fulfilling prophecy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mattdangerously Posted June 27, 2014 Share Posted June 27, 2014 His matches aren't very good either. That's kind of important. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greggulator Posted June 27, 2014 Share Posted June 27, 2014 When I was regularly doing comedy open-mics, I nearly referred to my favorite set-closing joke as my "go-home". My old stand-up set was essentially a pro wrestling promo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greggulator Posted June 27, 2014 Share Posted June 27, 2014 Ryder was a friggin' plague. I hated those videos. I mean, I hate them with the fiery passion of one million volcano eruptions. I'm all for low-fi, poorly produced videos but they were the lamest stuff. It was a lot of poor ways to incorporate "broski" in various puns and the like. They were just the absolute worst. I celebrate him crashing and burning. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SirSmUgly Posted June 27, 2014 Share Posted June 27, 2014 I will say this: Ryder isn't that good in-ring and has a character that can only take him so far, but he did actually get himself over with a not-wholly-insignificant number of fans. I don't see how a token US title reign leading into a severe de-push and being taken off TV equates to milking Ryder's popularity for whatever it was truly worth. I don't blame Ryder for getting over without talking to Vince McMahon. I blame McMahon for being short-sighted. Even if they use him as a joke character that gets a couple skits a month and the occasional long-shot spot in Elimination Chamber or MITB, that would be utilizing him in a better way than what they did. I think WWE needs to be better at maximizing what they have. Ziggler is another guy that does nothing for me outside of the bumps, but that is still mystifyingly over with the crowd. That means he has SOMETHING that a lot of people want to see and invest themselves in, even if I don't get it. They can use him better than "guy who trades wins and losses on Superstars." The Ryder fans who don't like Cena or Ziggler or Bryan will have their guy to watch the show for, and the Cena fans who don't like Ryder or Ziggler or Bryan will have theirs, and etcetera and etcetera. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cristobal Posted June 27, 2014 Share Posted June 27, 2014 The fact is that Ryder's "push" was not designed to get him over long-term. The "lol Ryder sux" crowd is missing the damn point. He went outside the box to create something for himself, which is exactly what everyone from Vince to Austin have been saying is what you need to do. If he'd gotten some kind of a chance, and just screwed it up, well so be it. But since he never got that chance, it's a hugely demotivating force to people in the locker room. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mattdangerously Posted June 27, 2014 Share Posted June 27, 2014 Except that he got a chance. If he isn't good enough to stay afloat even with the shitty booking, then that's on him. Lots of guys have been given worse storylines and still managed to find a way to stay successful. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnnyJ Posted June 27, 2014 Share Posted June 27, 2014 Name them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cool arrow Posted June 27, 2014 Share Posted June 27, 2014 I dunno know about "lots of guys," but Kane's storylines tend to be god-awful. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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