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Any who,

 

I was talking to a friend about the differences between previous WWE development hell holes call ups and NXT call ups.

 

I feel like NXT is too polished. This leads to a lot of people's flaws being covered up by smoke and mirrors (fuck you, Cody Rhodes) and don't really learn how to translate what they do to bigger audiences. They like learn how to do a match formula with a set character, but don't learn how to inject any natural personality into their matches. So, when these people get called up, the debuts seem to fail more than succeed. Mah friend said that I was too hard on Big E. because in NXT, Big E. had a big time feel to him even though no one cares for him on Raw. Same thing with Paige, whom just randomly screams and does movezy shit to me.

 

Compared to an OVW or FCW call up, they have seemed more personality driven, and even though most of them have taken a while to get good in the ring, the WWE crowds are responding to them a hell of a lot better than the NXT alumni.

 

 

I just wanted to get other people's opinion on this.

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I'm watching Justice Pain vs Nick Mondo vs The Messiah vs Adam Flash. I liked it enough, but it got me thinking, three of the guys got a lot of talk back in the day one way or another, but not Adam Flash. I'm curious from those that know, what were your thoughts on him?

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Any who,

 

I was talking to a friend about the differences between previous WWE development hell holes call ups and NXT call ups.

 

I feel like NXT is too polished. This leads to a lot of people's flaws being covered up by smoke and mirrors (fuck you, Cody Rhodes) and don't really learn how to translate what they do to bigger audiences. They like learn how to do a match formula with a set character, but don't learn how to inject any natural personality into their matches. So, when these people get called up, the debuts seem to fail more than succeed. Mah friend said that I was too hard on Big E. because in NXT, Big E. had a big time feel to him even though no one cares for him on Raw. Same thing with Paige, whom just randomly screams and does movezy shit to me.

 

Compared to an OVW or FCW call up, they have seemed more personality driven, and even though most of them have taken a while to get good in the ring, the WWE crowds are responding to them a hell of a lot better than the NXT alumni.

 

 

I just wanted to get other people's opinion on this.

My opinion is all of your opinions are horrible. Paige doing "movezy shit", for one, and pretty much everything else as well.

What, the Shield and the Wyatts don't get crowd reaction? As for the "OVW callups" Batista was doing nothing as D-Von Dudley's muscle before he got put into Evolution, or that paragon of personality, Shelton Benjamin.

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I'm watching Justice Pain vs Nick Mondo vs The Messiah vs Adam Flash. I liked it enough, but it got me thinking, three of the guys got a lot of talk back in the day one way or another, but not Adam Flash. I'm curious from those that know, what were your thoughts on him?

I always liked Flash in my CZW days, and the few times I've revisited my old tapes in the last year I've still liked him. The commentary always talked up the "11 year veteran" bit, and it did seem like he worked with the CZW trainees a bit more than the main eventers did. His team with Ian Knoxx was quite fun, back when I thought Knoxx was a nailed-on future big star (and I maintain only injuries stopped that)

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Flash was an example of "a good hand" in that he was a decent enough wrestler and could make other people look good but didn't really have "it" as far as coming off as a big star.  His teams with Knoxx and Danny Rose were both entertaining and he was at his best when he had a tag partner he could play off of well.

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I can agree with that, he definitely filled the role of being more of a perennial Iron Man title of a guy than a World title guy, but can fill the role of occasionally contender like he was at I believe Cage of Death 6 with that awkward title/bounty match, he was fine there but the match itself didn't make much sense iirc

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TNA vs WWE on Monday nights was the Anglo-Zanzibar War of professional wrestling, only somehow shorter. The war was over when TNA I think opened with that stupid as fuck cage match where Homicide got stuck upside down and the fans chanted "change the channel". That was the end the rest was just scorched Earth.

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Has anyone brought up the idea of turning Reigns heel when the Shield splits?

There's always this expectation the other two will turn but out of nowhere tonight my lapsed wrestling fan friends who hates the current product but watches it because his brother does just flew off the handle about how the Uso's are stupid and Reigns should break off and join them and talk about how their Samoan heritage is so strong and say they've been abused, put them in suits with Heyman as manager as the new Samoan Hit Squad.

I think there is something there, if they really want to make reigns a star shouldn't he do it as a bad guy a la Austin and Rock?

His other awesome idea is to make a group of Barrett, Sheamus, Harper and Rowan (post Wyatt break up) as tough guys managed by a mostly retired Big Show. He was really on a roll IMO.

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I feel like NXT is too polished. This leads to a lot of people's flaws being covered up by smoke and mirrors (fuck you, Cody Rhodes) and don't really learn how to translate what they do to bigger audiences. They like learn how to do a match formula with a set character, but don't learn how to inject any natural personality into their matches. So, when these people get called up, the debuts seem to fail more than succeed. Mah friend said that I was too hard on Big E. because in NXT, Big E. had a big time feel to him even though no one cares for him on Raw. Same thing with Paige, whom just randomly screams and does movezy shit to me.
Eh, a lot of the failure is on WWE, itself, rather than the performer.  Big E. got over, despite being initially disliked mainly based on his look (Very muscular and hoss-y), because he had a really entertaining personality and catch-phrase (He had decent promos, had the 5-count, the "Gimme 5" and his theme song was better and reflected the whole "Five" deal), he gets called up to WWE, he gets changed right over to being a heel who doesn't talk despite working the past however months as a face who does, then randomly turns face on a Smackdown, gets no promo time, and they dump the whole "Gimme 5" gimmick, but keep the song with the lyrics "Three ain't enough, I need five"?!  That would be like Bray Wyatt coming up to Raw, but keeping his old Husky Harris theme.
 
For every big-time success from OVW, you had just as many failures: for every Lesnar, Orton or Batista you had Johnny Jeter, Damaja, The Hearthrobs, Kevin Thorn and Paul Burchill.  Just like in  WWE for every Wyatt Family, Shield, etc. you're gonna have a few Mason Ryans.  It's just the nature of developing athletes, look at any professional sport: Peyton Manning or Ryan Leaf, Michael Jordan or Sam Bowie, Alex Daigle or Chris Pronger.  There's always gonna be guys with major potential who bust, and others who live up to it.  I'd say NXT's track record, so far, is not too shabby: they gave us two of the best current stables.
 
Also, isn't it a little early to be saying Paige is a failure?  She got a major reaction on her first show, and has only been there about a month.  If you go by that logic, Wade Barrett should have been long-ago turfed before winning the US title, because he's done nothing since Nexus.
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Has anyone brought up the idea of turning Reigns heel when the Shield splits?

There's always this expectation the other two will turn but out of nowhere tonight my lapsed wrestling fan friends who hates the current product but watches it because his brother does just flew off the handle about how the Uso's are stupid and Reigns should break off and join them and talk about how their Samoan heritage is so strong and say they've been abused, put them in suits with Heyman as manager as the new Samoan Hit Squad.

I think there is something there, if they really want to make reigns a star shouldn't he do it as a bad guy a la Austin and Rock?

This is all awesome. And they can wreck everyone's shit.

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Has anyone brought up the idea of turning Reigns heel when the Shield splits?

There's always this expectation the other two will turn but out of nowhere tonight my lapsed wrestling fan friends who hates the current product but watches it because his brother does just flew off the handle about how the Uso's are stupid and Reigns should break off and join them and talk about how their Samoan heritage is so strong and say they've been abused, put them in suits with Heyman as manager as the new Samoan Hit Squad.

I think there is something there, if they really want to make reigns a star shouldn't he do it as a bad guy a la Austin and Rock?

 

If they decide he's the guy to beat Bryan, then yeah it makes a fair bit of sense.

 

If not, doesn't work. They've already established him as being above Ambrose and Rollins, so beating them means little, and seems silly to use him to elevate the other two.

 

I've been hoping they recreate the thumbs up/down beatdown but with Orton and Batista's roles swapped if and when they need to write him out of storylines to promote GotG, as a way of HHH showing Orton he can trust him.

 

Using Reigns in that spot would be even better, and seemingly logical way of continuing the evolutionary premise.

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Dropping someone's gimmick and putting them in suits has been done before, and it turned out awful (Swagger, Rhodes, Miz) and the Usos have shown they are way better at working as faces than heels.

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Dropping someone's gimmick and putting them in suits has been done before, and it turned out awful (Swagger, Rhodes, Miz) and the Usos have shown they are way better at working as faces than heels.

 

 

Suit Swagger after winning the title was the worst, he went from being this asshole jock athlete to... a serious guy in a suit. Yeah that'll get him over.

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The Usos can keep doing their haka and jumping all over the place forever.....if it ain't broke don't fix it......HOW LONG CAN STONE COLD KEEP DRINKING BEER AND STUNNING PEOPLE QUICK GIVE HIM A COMBOVER.....stick with what brought you to the dance

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That might actually be the perfect way to turn the Usos heel. Have one, (say, Jey,) start acting heelish, taking shortcuts in matches, attacking opponents afterward, with Jimmy getting bothered by his twin's actions, then, when we're all primed for Uso vs Uso, they reveal that actually they've just been fucking with everybody, that half the time "Jey" started acting out, it was Jimmy, and no one could tell the difference.

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Somehow we got a ton of Seinfeld references in the middle of a discussion about Bret Hart, WCW babyface and the Monday Night Wars

 

I love this board. 

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Guys, is a clean win still clean if it involves stuff that would normally cause a DQ but match stips exclude DQs?  For example, ADR won the WWE belt at HITC 2011 in a No DQ HITC match.  Does this count as a clean win?

 

For me a clean win is one person pinning another in the middle of the ring with zero interference or shenanigans. If there's a ref bump, ref distraction, a run-in, etc. then it's not a clean win, regardless of stipulation.

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That might actually be the perfect way to turn the Usos heel. Have one, (say, Jey,) start acting heelish, taking shortcuts in matches, attacking opponents afterward, with Jimmy getting bothered by his twin's actions, then, when we're all primed for Uso vs Uso, they reveal that actually they've just been fucking with everybody, that half the time "Jey" started acting out, it was Jimmy, and no one could tell the difference.

That would work if one didn't have a large tattoo on his chest.

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