WWE turning popular heels into intolerable babyfaces

[Skeeball Wizard]

True, but wrestlers are, by and large, not politicians or actors. I'll echo the statement of whoever said they'd rather see a guy fall on his face on his own then repeat something someone wrote word for word for him. Whatever comes out in an unscripted situation is what that person's character is, then you build around that. Its amazing how much modern day WWE fights against this.

[Spontaneous]

Doesn't help that their scripts they read from suck. You can go all Daniel Day Lewis on it, he isn't making any of this into interesting material.

[Ziggy]

Mark Henry is a decent babyface even though he's a way better heel

He was such a cheesy babyface early on in his career, He has to be the Greatest example of over coming bad angles and storylines and turning into a success

[The Z]

I wish they would let at least some of the roster go out there and just speak. Ryback unleashed would be far more entertaining than whatever tough guy lines they feed him now.

 

So basically what you're saying is: Feed him less?

 

 

Sorry, couldn't resist.

[Goodear]

Mark Henry is a decent babyface even though he's a way better heel

He was such a cheesy babyface early on in his career, He has to be the Greatest example of over coming bad angles and storylines and turning into a success

 

Kane says hello.

[T.Rex-n-effeckx]

At this point everyone in WWE comes through WWE developmental. The excuse that "these guys aren't trained actors" doesn't work anymore. These guys are trained to work for the camera there is no reason they shouldn't also be trained in how to read their lines.

I think the face turns that have killed people the worst in last decade were Carlito and Miz.

It's also worth pointing out that the WWF/WWE has always struggled with what to do when heels have fans in ways that other feds (which accepted there would be heel fans didn't). It's part of why they muted the crowd pops for Vader's Vadersault,etc.

[Just Dave]

At this point everyone in WWE comes through WWE developmental. The excuse that "these guys aren't trained actors" doesn't work anymore. These guys are trained to work for the camera there is no reason they shouldn't also be trained in how to read their lines.

I think the face turns that have killed people the worst in last decade were Carlito and Miz.

It's also worth pointing out that the WWF/WWE has always struggled with what to do when heels have fans in ways that other feds (which accepted there would be heel fans didn't). It's part of why they muted the crowd pops for Vader's Vadersault,etc.

I'd throw Kennedy in there, too.

[Petey]

I'd include Del Rio. I thought he was a great heel and was someone I'd love to hate if I saw him live, but turning him face and changing his entrance theme just wasn't smart.

[Spontaneous]

Didn't help with Del Rio how they did the face turn. He just turned against 3MB for threatening the spanish announce team. No build or anything, he just went from feuding with Orton to face.

[GuerrillaMonsoon]

Miz was fucked well before the face turn.

[thee Reverend Axl Future]

Several lifetimes ago, Jimmy Snuka was turned from a feared heel to one of the top babyfaces. They need to study their own history.

- RAF

[Go2Sleep]

Didn't help with Del Rio how they did the face turn. He just turned against 3MB for threatening the spanish announce team. No build or anything, he just went from feuding with Orton to face.

 

I think that part was actually ok. Ricardo was a borderline face already and ADR ran out and destroyed 3MB with some really good looking offense to a big pop. It was surprising but not unbelievable that he would protect his friend from other heels. Losing the cars and getting a pandering "USA USA" gimmick is what did him in.

[MORELOCK]

Losing the cars and getting a pandering "USA USA" gimmick is what did him in.

 

 

I know this is a popular opinion on here, but what on earth did coming out in expensive cars do to get Del Rio over? Would it really have had any effect on his heat or the character if he had debuted and just come out via the Gorilla position?

[Go2Sleep]

It was just a big part of his persona and a unique entrance. Pretending to be modest, hard-working man after 2 years of coming out in nice cars just added to the phony, transparent pandering that made sure he never got over (and in fact had to turn heel again  6 months later because no one was cheering him despite him having his absolute best run of matches ever).

[Petey]

It was just a big part of his persona and a unique entrance. Pretending to be modest, hard-working man after 2 years of coming out in nice cars just added to the phony, transparent pandering that made sure he never got over (and in fact had to turn heel again  6 months later because no one was cheering him despite him having his absolute best run of matches ever).

Exactly.

 

Del Rio's entrance was unique. It was different. That's valuable in today's era of the professional wrestling.

[Goodear]

In my opinion, Del Rio was a fruit not worth the squeeze. That being said they cut anything distinct about him off the steak. Personal ring announcer gone, car gone, wearing his own T-shirt to the ring (not okay for the character).  Someone else on another board mentioned this and I didn't even notice but they took the man's *wink* for pity's sake.  Now if it was me, I would have taken away the cars because its not really integral to the character and its been done before.  Ricardo had to go from the heel act because he was too charismatic but you insert Vicky Guerrero in there and the whole thing becomes a heat magnet.  Maybe through the guy on a horse now and again for big events and really play into the Novela bad guy images and you have more than you have now.

[Spontaneous]

 

Didn't help with Del Rio how they did the face turn. He just turned against 3MB for threatening the spanish announce team. No build or anything, he just went from feuding with Orton to face.

 

I think that part was actually ok. Ricardo was a borderline face already and ADR ran out and destroyed 3MB with some really good looking offense to a big pop. It was surprising but not unbelievable that he would protect his friend from other heels. Losing the cars and getting a pandering "USA USA" gimmick is what did him in.

 

 

I think to go from rich cool guy to Mexican hero he needed something a bit more. If they had done the Swagger-Del Rio feud first it might have worked better. They just kept taking from Del Rio what made him unique and he became this generic face. Plus he wrestled on TV so often that he was this bland, over-saturated face. I can still see your point though, I do agree that losing his personality was the death blow.

 

Now he is "feuding" with Batista and so far he has been, except for one sneak attack, completely dominated and I would not blame him for leaving once his contract is up. They have misused him big time.

[MORELOCK]

Now if it was me, I would have taken away the cars because its not really integral to the character and its been done before.

 

This is all I meant - I get that they took away all the unique aspects of his character and that is what killed him, I just never viewed the cars as one of those aspects. If he had still lost everything else and kept the car entrance, the face run would still have fallen on its face.

[Goodear]

I think to go from rich cool guy to Mexican hero he needed something a bit more. If they had done the Swagger-Del Rio feud first it might have worked better. They just kept taking from Del Rio what made him unique and he became this generic face. Plus he wrestled on TV so often that he was this bland, over-saturated face. I can still see your point though, I do agree that losing his personality was the death blow.

 

Now he is "feuding" with Batista and so far he has been, except for one sneak attack, completely dominated and I would not blame him for leaving once his contract is up. They have misused him big time.

 

I have reached the opinion that he never really had a personality and that is why he had to be covered in gimmicks and a huge push in order to get over at all.  How many World Title Reigns did the guy get and he is less over than Kofi Kingston who they haven't invested anything in other than midcard titles and two meaningless wins over Randy Orton.  If he now can't get over with all the time and energy they invested in him, it is time for him to do jobs.  Lots of jobs.  Job him to anyone and everyone I says.  

[Spontaneous]

To be fair, the world title was junk during his reigns. He got forced awkwardly into Cena-Punk and had to feud with Dolph Ziggler whom WWE feels is junk. Whether he is over with the fans or not is hard to gauge given how poorly he and the rest of the roster have been booked for a long time. Too much even stevens booking and when they don't do the even stevens they somehow make it worse.

[JohnnyJ]

ADR was on a steady rise until he was foolishly thrown into the Punk-Cena feud. Once he flopped as champ (which was inevitable) they jobbed him out on tv a bunch of times to Cena/Punk. He lost his aura and never came across as a true contender again.

I view him as someone who could not come back from a barrage of credibility killing losses.

[Tromatagon]

So basically his WWE career is like his MMA career

[Thomas Bugg]

Had to revive this thread because it seems I called a lot of this shit happening. Roman gets booed out of the building on a weekly basis by even some of the most non-smark filled WWE crowds, and that catchphrase of his-Believe THAT!- is is so fucking unoriginal it's ridiculous. But at least he gets something whenever he comes out, unlike Erick Rowan who gets a pindrop whenever he makes his entrances. I knew last year that if the Wyatt Family split, he'd do the worst out of all three of them, and so far I was right. 

 

But at least those two had a chance to actually fucking be heels- The New Day were supposed to be Nation Of Domination 3000, only with better workers and talkers than the original (excluding Faarooq, The Rock and D-Lo of course). But then somebody in creative decided that they should have testimonials that don't say a goddamn thing, dance and do call-and-response to the crowd, and clap....and clap.....and clap....and clap! Yeah, like your average wrestling fan is gonna get behind a bunch of Kirk Franklin wannabes. The sad part about this whole thing is these three are actually talented, and their careers are going to shit quickly.

[Cristobal]

New Day went face because Ferguson happened, and I think it's arguably progress that WWE recognizes they should not get anywhere near racial politics when it's a hot-button issue.

They probably shouldn't get near it when it ISN'T one, either, but then you just end up with "The Real Americans" and trying to get heat off of Glenn Beck.

[Thomas Bugg]

New Day went face because Ferguson happened, and I think it's arguably progress that WWE recognizes they should not get anywhere near racial politics when it's a hot-button issue.

They probably shouldn't get near it when it ISN'T one, either, but then you just end up with "The Real Americans" and trying to get heat off of Glenn Beck.

 

Guess they figured they didn't want the shit that happened to Slaughter or Mohammed Hassan repeating itself.