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AEW Dynamite - 2/1/2023


The Natural

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I was busy watching Infinity Pool last night and came home completely bewildered and not even thinking about Dynamite, so I came back to it tonight. 

It's a real hard vote: which is the best match between Page/Mox, Danielson/Thatcher or Joe/Allin? Everything else did its job (I really liked the ladies' stuff getting set up and Jade getting a win in front of her kid) but these two were some heavy meat for a card. My nod is probably Page/Mox. The only thing I disliked was the AVALANCHE~! Death Valley Driver which after seeing it once again should DEFINITELY be a pinfall victory. Everything else -- the avoidance of typical offense by Moxley, the lack of bomb-throwing in favor of brawling, the plain no-bullshitness of it -- was great. 

Bryan/Timmy was great in its own way. This one felt like Hanson coming into your territory and beating/stretching the shit out of your babyface champ... Rick Martel, I suppose? Thatcher would be great as a hired gun in the future, like Nick Gage, the horror movie villain that you didn't expect showing up to fuck you up. Or to provide another analogy, the miniboss that is hard as hell to beat to get to the main boss. 

...and to bring up video games again, Cage/Takeshita was your standard video game wrestling match between two slabs of beef with move skills. The MJF match will be better. 

Christ, am I about to forget Joe and Darby?! That was nuts. Joe has incredible presence, more than just about anyone working right now. Darby backed it up with the madness that wracks his brain and he pushes into his matches. Joe and Mox need to have a backstage contest as to "Who Did The Best Dusty Bladejob?"

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On 2/1/2023 at 10:26 PM, Andrew POE! said:

I haven't seen the match yet, but oof at giving the TNT title back to Samoa Joe. Why would TK go through the trouble of having Darby Allin beat challengers (like Mike Bennett, Juice Robinson, Kushida, and Buddy Matthews) that were increasingly harder but then have a wrestler on his decline and injury prone (if we're being honest) like Samoa Joe beat him? Allin could have still won the match and they could have had the post-match for Joe & Wardlow and Joe wouldn't have lost his heat.

Tony Khan, booking genius everyone.

This is a bad take. No disrespect meant, but Joe is not washed / injury prone. He's been in AEW for almost a year now. He's only taken time off for movie projects. He's had a lot of high end, high impact matches. And he's looked great in my opinion. This is one of those instances where the way AEW books plays to certain talent's strengths. Joe doesn't need to be in 52 TV matches a year. He loses his aura if he's out there doing 50-50 15 minute TV matches every week. It also saves his body.

As for the booking, again respectfully disagree. I find it one of the best things they've done. Darby got an awesome moment in his hometown. We got 6 or 7 really awesome TNT Title matches, counting the 2 with Joe. It got Darby back on our screens. It gave Wardlow time to heal up. It gave the him & Joe story time to breathe. It gave Joe a reason to get a mean streak and level up a notch. Now when Wardlow beats him at the ppv for it (if that's the way they go), he is better off than he was when Joe initially won the title.

It's booking that made everyone involved better off. Darby may have lost the title, but his character can't be an underdog if he never loses. Not everyone can nor should be booked like Super Cena. It's perfectly within the bonds of that character for his body to give out from accumulated damage from all his psycho stunts. He loses nothing losing it back to Joe. And finally, the world title is always going to have long reigns (by way of the title being defended so rarely). It makes total sense to have a secondary title contrast that by changing a lot, because it's defended a lot more.

Edited by NoFistsJustFlips
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Just finished. 
 

1) The opening match was a predictably great fight. Mox and Page are great dance partners. It is so clear in how they wrestle/fight they they hate each other and they they both are coming from different places. The end of the match was a great “gotcha” where Mox, the street tough, tricked the more technically proficient Hangman with a roll-up in what was a brawl. In a lot of ways that is a cheap shot. I can watch these guys keep this feud up for another few months and not get tired

2) I love The Ass Boys. I love The Acclaimed. I loved their first feud. I hate this one. The As Boys throwing shots about their dad being an addict and the like — that just feels like cheap heat to me. I think The Ass Boys have so much more natural heel talent then throwing out MJF bombs like that. 

3) How many outfits does MJF wear throughout the course of one show? 

4) Dragon/Thatcher was good stuff. That was my first time seeing Thatcher and he has a great “I have broken someone’s thumb for leaning on my car in a convenience store parking lot” look. I liked that the match is a continuation from last week and then building to the Iron Man match. It makes sense to give BD a weakness going into that match so there is psychologist for MJF being able to get a reasonably clean fall against a guy billed as the best to ever do it. I cannot wait to see all the fun stuff that comes in that match.

4) I am absolutely over Jade as she currently exists. They are just recycling opponents for her now. Red Velvet is not so good. Jade is still so new and she had to carry Red Velvet. They really need to get Jade mixed in with the rest of the roster — Jamie, Britt, Ruby, etc. She would be incredible if she could have matches against the talented part of the Women’s division. Who has she wrested against that isn’t a few steps beyond recent wrestling schooo graduate? I know she wrestled Willow and Stat and Athena. Anyone else? But then the end gets weird because the story they are telling is that Jade was cruel to The Baddies… and then she goes and gets her kid after she wins. I mean, I get wanting your kid to see you in action, but man you can’t have a badass heel storming through the roster then cuddling with her adorable child. One of the things about a winning streak angle is that eventually it has to end. And the ends are almost always anticlimactic. 

5) Does Darby Allin have a responsible adult in his life who can tell him no? I mean by all means ruin your spinal mobility for my entertainment, but when Joe was setting him up for the muscle buster onto the exposed wood made me wish we had a camera backstage when they were putting that match together with Joe repeatedly telling Darby all of the reasons why that was a bad idea before finally relenting. That match was great from a story and psychology perspective of Darby using everything he could get his hands on to take out a monster. Really clever things like the thumbtack jacket. I also thought Joe was going to end up with some horrible infection from the powder mixing in this his cut eye. Really great stuff but also Darby needs to talk to someone.

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17 minutes ago, Greggulator said:

She would be incredible if she could have matches against the talented part of the Women’s division. Who has she wrested against that isn’t a few steps beyond recent wrestling schooo graduate? I know she wrestled Willow and Stat and Athena. Anyone else?

Thunder Rosa, Ruby to win the title, Nyla, Tay, Santana Garrett, Madison Rayne, Diamante, The Bunny, Kiera Hogan

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1 hour ago, StuntmanCrowley said:

I still am on the hill of "Anyone but Stat or Willow beating Jade will be a dissappointment"

Agreed. I'd still go with Kris Statlander. I think that was the plan till Kris did her ACL in again.

Speaking of knees, any updates on the woman's wrestler who had a Roman/Goddess like gimmick who comes down the ring with servants. Megan something?

Edited by The Natural
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1 hour ago, The Natural said:

Agreed. I'd still go with Kris Statlander. I think that was the plan till Kris did her ACL in again.

Speaking of knees, any updates on the woman's wrestler who had a Roman/Goddess like gimmick who comes down the ring with servants. Megan something?

Megan Bayne.

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I’ll break it down further tonight, but damn was this just a great night of dudes kicking the shit out of each other. In wwe hangman page & Mox would’ve been forced to team up & win the tag titles while in a blood feud. These guys pull off animosity so well that now that’s kind of what I want. 

Also, I’m finding that my enjoyment level of AEW programming is inversely proportionate to the amount of elite/adam Cole on the show, so this shit was right up my alley. All the flippy self aggrandizing dorks with shitty hair can stay home. The grown men are fucking murdering each other tonight. Also I’ll never not be happy to see Jade and Red Velvet. For reasons.

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I continue to turn around my opinion on Jade.  She was pretty great with Red and I can see these two having a long term series in the future.  Long gone is a lot of that bad foot work that made her seem clumsy.  Jade these days seems a lot more comfortable in the ring.

Another great episode of Dynamite.  Boom.  

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Meltzer:

Hangman Adam Page vs. Jon Moxley: ****1/2.

Konosuke Takeshita vs. Brian Cage: ***3/4.

Bryan Danielson vs. Timothy Thatcher: ***3/4.

Darby Allin vs. Samoa Joe: ****1/4.

Meltzer has really overrated Takeshita/Cage and underrated Danielson/Thatcher:

Natural:

Hangman Adam Page vs. Jon Moxley: ****1/2.

Konosuke Takeshita vs. Brian Cage: ***.

Bryan Danielson vs. Timothy Thatcher: ****1/2. MOTN.

Darby Allin vs. Samoa Joe: ****1/2.

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For what it's worth, Darby has said repeatedly that he always feels great and he attributes that to a ton of stretching and massage therapy. I think he's just like some MMA fighters that have a concrete head. Eventually that wears off, but for now he's good.

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3 hours ago, Craig H said:

For what it's worth, Darby has said repeatedly that he always feels great and he attributes that to a ton of stretching and massage therapy. I think he's just like some MMA fighters that have a concrete head. Eventually that wears off, but for now he's good.

Knowing he is straight-edge, I assume that by not using alcohol or heavy pain-killers to numb the pain helps him be more aware of what he can and can't do and when to take it easy.

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19 hours ago, L_W_P said:

Jeff Hardy is right there for him to see his future if he keeps doing this.

For all his influence and power I hope Sting isn't sitting by and letting this happen, or worse, ENCOURAGING it. He needs to be slowing Darby down or talking to Tony and getting Darby re-booked as a special attraction that only works a few matches a year.

Jeff Hardy's breakout year as a singles guy was 2001. During that year, he wrestled over 160 matches. In 2021, Darby Allin wrestled 36 matches. What's gonna keep these guys alive and well isn't just CBD, Tinder instead of the club + Xbox, it's the diminishing returns of the house show market / emergence of revenue streams that don't involve bumping.

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3 hours ago, Craig H said:

For what it's worth, Darby has said repeatedly that he always feels great and he attributes that to a ton of stretching and massage therapy. I think he's just like some MMA fighters that have a concrete head. Eventually that wears off, but for now he's good.

RVD said he would spend an hour stretching and warming up before a match. Seemed to work well for him

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20 hours ago, The Natural said:

Meltzer:

Hangman Adam Page vs. Jon Moxley: ****1/2.

Konosuke Takeshita vs. Brian Cage: ***3/4.

Bryan Danielson vs. Timothy Thatcher: ***3/4.

Darby Allin vs. Samoa Joe: ****1/4.

Meltzer has really overrated Takeshita/Cage and underrated Danielson/Thatcher:

Natural:

Hangman Adam Page vs. Jon Moxley: ****1/2.

Konosuke Takeshita vs. Brian Cage: ***.

Bryan Danielson vs. Timothy Thatcher: ****1/2. MOTN.

Darby Allin vs. Samoa Joe: ****1/2.

Based on how close your other two ratings are to his do you think it could simply be a case of his liking Takeshita as much as you do Danielson? Because to me he got the ratings spot on. I didn’t think Danielson/Thatcher was the best of the night, and even with giving it the same rating as Takeshita/Cage I’d say it was the worst match of the big four. 

I get your praising Bryan when’s he’s great, but sometimes it feels like you’re trying to overvalue all of his performances, and no matter what else happens on the show you’ll make it out that he was the highlight.

Don’t get it wrong I’m a fan of his too, but not every week is a home run. 

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1 hour ago, LF2 said:

Based on how close your other two ratings are to his do you think it could simply be a case of his liking Takeshita as much as you do Danielson? Because to me he got the ratings spot on. I didn’t think Danielson/Thatcher was the best of the night, and even with giving it the same rating as Takeshita/Cage I’d say it was the worst match of the big four. 

I get your praising Bryan when’s he’s great, but sometimes it feels like you’re trying to overvalue all of his performances, and no matter what else happens on the show you’ll make it out that he was the highlight.

Don’t get it wrong I’m a fan of his too, but not every week is a home run. 

Hard disagree with you saying Bryan/Thatcher was the worst of the four. More often than not Bryan is the best thing on the shows. The GOAT's not perfect. It was only last week I said Danielson/Cage was one of Bryan's worst matches. Page and Allin had better bouts with Cage.

Edited by The Natural
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1 hour ago, The Natural said:

Hard disagree with you saying Bryan/Thatcher was the worst of the four. More often than not Bryan is the best thing on the shows. The GOAT's not perfect. It was only last week I said Danielson/Cage was one of Bryan's worst matches. Page and Allin had better bouts with Cage.

I did say I’d rank it evenly with Cage/Takeshita, but I did get more enjoyment out of Cage/Takeshita. I didn’t mean to downplay Bryan as my bigger issue with the Thatcher match was Thatcher. I’m personally not a fan, and I didn’t care for him in NXT either. To me he’s someone that badly needs a manager in order to be over, and even then I wouldn’t buy him as a main event guy. 

I agree on who’s had better matches with Cage too, but I felt that was more the story they told him and Bryan to work than it was a bad outing from either guy. 

Honestly I’m just over this angle already, and feeling extremely confident that MJF wins at Revolution isn’t helping either. Especially when the angle first started it was “Bryan must beat the AEW top 5”, and now it’s like okay he’s beaten Cage, a guy that’s never worked for AEW, and Rush (assuming he will this week). How’s that remotely top 5? I expected at least two out of the following 5: Jericho, Garcia, Starks, Hangman, and Mox. I’m pretty sure you’ll be in agreement that even if they only subbed Mox for Rush that this would be a more sensible angle, and give Bryan a huge win at the end.

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2 hours ago, LF2 said:

Honestly I’m just over this angle already, and feeling extremely confident that MJF wins at Revolution isn’t helping either. Especially when the angle first started it was “Bryan must beat the AEW top 5”, and now it’s like okay he’s beaten Cage, a guy that’s never worked for AEW, and Rush (assuming he will this week). How’s that remotely top 5? I expected at least two out of the following 5: Jericho, Garcia, Starks, Hangman, and Mox. I’m pretty sure you’ll be in agreement that even if they only subbed Mox for Rush that this would be a more sensible angle, and give Bryan a huge win at the end.

I'm not quite sure, but I think they said Bryan needs to wrestle every week and win until February 8, in order to become the No. 1 contender. They didn't specify he needs to beat the Top 5 (which WOULD of course make sense), but I guess winning that many matches would make his 2023 win-loss record better than anyone else's at the moment. It is possible that the way AEW rotates the wrestlers, nobody else has had the chance to win 5 matches yet this year, much less in a row.

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59 minutes ago, Shartnado said:

I'm not quite sure, but I think they said Bryan needs to wrestle every week and win until February 8, in order to become the No. 1 contender. They didn't specify he needs to beat the Top 5 (which WOULD of course make sense), but I guess winning that many matches would make his 2023 win-loss record better than anyone else's at the moment. It is possible that the way AEW rotates the wrestlers, nobody else has had the chance to win 5 matches yet this year, much less in a row.

I want to say the week he beat Takeshita that MJF claimed he had to defeat the top 5. Which I had no issue with Takeshita (and I really like Bandido too) being in the top 5, but once it got to Cage and more so Thatcher this week it’s like these guys wouldn’t be in the top 5. As you stated his win loss record would be better than most anyone (I’m not sure if he had more wins or Darby did), but it still feels like somebody goofed when they said top 5. If it wasn’t MJF then it was Excalibur on commentary. Which the way he’s forced into telling us ten matches in thirty seconds I see how he could goof. 

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I’m a fan of the angle. It gives Danielson a weekly opponent, MJF can have segments continuing the story without it being the standard long in ring promos we’ve seen, and with the hurt arm/shoulder it allows reasonable competitive matches to parallel when he was a dominant heel mowing through the Dark Order. It also makes sense that Danielson’s has to build up his wins for a title shot, I recall him losing a bit. Bryan is a solid name to lose to MJF for his first big defense.

Danielson vs Thatcher was right up my alley. The style is very much in what I would point to where I nerd out the most.  I’m mesmerized by the Masochist vs Sadist that was Joe vs Darby, Mox vs Hangman’s tough guy story is a great feud, and Muscle Mohawk vs Innocent Cinnabon was an exciting treat. I don’t agree with @LF2 that Dragon-Thatcher was the fourth best of that lineup, but very much respect his opinion. If it gets posted online or there’s a way I can rewatch, I’d love to ramble on these matches in more detail.
I want to take a moment to say the @The Natural is often pretty fair in his appreciation of the American Dragon. Because he is very expressive of his love and can be excited to share as much as he can, I feel he can get dismissed as being a fanboy. He has been critical when he felt Danielson’s matches or segments fell short which I respect. Something we don’t see too often online (mostly elsewhere) where people flip out when their favorites are not loved to the same degree. 
——

On @Greggulator’s Jade thoughts:

I was honestly hoping we were going to see an evolution of character after the Nyla feud. A talented, vulnerable, yet still charmingly confident champion. Someone doesn’t need to be a smiling babyface to take on the bad guys. I think a tweener can tween but how this tweening has twun, the tweener tweened wasn’t twed well. Not to fantasy book, but I had a brief moment of excitement for character growth and not sure I’m seeing it. I’m all in favor of the daughter hug, but play with that. I’m even all in favor of Red Velvet going full circle to facing Jade again as a story. But something is off. Maybe ass Greg put it, Jade needs more experienced workers to work with. 

——

Samoa Joe is so cool.

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8 hours ago, Octopus said:

Danielson vs Thatcher was right up my alley. The style is very much in what I would point to where I nerd out the most.  I’m mesmerized by the Masochist vs Sadist that was Joe vs Darby, Mox vs Hangman’s tough guy story is a great feud, and Muscle Mohawk vs Innocent Cinnabon was an exciting treat. I don’t agree with @LF2 that Dragon-Thatcher was the fourth best of that lineup, but very much respect his opinion. If it gets posted online or there’s a way I can rewatch, I’d love to ramble on these matches in more detail.

I want to take a moment to say the @The Natural is often pretty fair in his appreciation of the American Dragon. Because he is very expressive of his love and can be excited to share as much as he can, I feel he can get dismissed as being a fanboy. He has been critical when he felt Danielson’s matches or segments fell short which I respect. Something we don’t see too often online (mostly elsewhere) where people flip out when their favorites are not loved to the same degree. 
——

Thanks, @Octopus xxx.

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On 2/3/2023 at 7:50 PM, John E. Dynamite said:

Jeff Hardy's breakout year as a singles guy was 2001. During that year, he wrestled over 160 matches. In 2021, Darby Allin wrestled 36 matches. What's gonna keep these guys alive and well isn't just CBD, Tinder instead of the club + Xbox, it's the diminishing returns of the house show market / emergence of revenue streams that don't involve bumping.

That's better from the point of view of gradual wear and tear from repeat bumps and the associated fatigue of a gruelling touring schedule etc, but with the stuff Darby does he could easily kill or paralyse himself off a single bump

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