Secret Santo - Winter 2022/3!

[The Natural]

On 12/17/2022 at 4:54 PM, Matt D said:

I am cleverly getting around my tagging issues by quoting my partner here. You've invoked Bock's name so Bock you will receive. I thought about giving you the Zbyszko sprint because it's the easiest match to get through or the Morton Houston match since it has a lot of the key elements (Heenan, traveling champ Bock, a look at pre-RNR Morton as a spirited babyface), but I'm going to go with the Chavo match instead. Bock is tricky, because you do really need to watch a few matches to even start to really figure out what to look for, but as we don't have time for that, I'll give you some suggestions.

• His entrance into matches. The comparison point will always be Flair, of course, but Bockwinkel tries to understand his opponents and doesn't give you something generic to start. The character will have either a gameplan or a way he's feeling that night. Here, Chavo is a local favorite, but not someone on Bock's radar and he feels this is beneath him and he's trying to show him up and embarrass him.
• His reactions/expressions throughout the match. This is where he shines the most I think, how he engages within holds or when he's in a hold, how he reacts to things going his way or when things don't go his way. He's just living vibrantly in his matches in a way that's very organic and pulls the crowd/viewer in. He cares (elation, viciousness, desperation).
• His physical selling as the match goes on. I'd argue that he's the best ever at selling his entire body in the last third of the match, getting over the weight of everything that's happening. There's real and deep consequence in Bockwinkel matches. Things matter. That's where a lot of the value comes from as well as he works holds and as big as he bumps and as much as he can go.

Just a few things to think about as you watch this.

 

 

9 hours ago, Matt D said:

Paul owes me a week 2 one (but he is good for it, dammit). Super Ape is working on one for DEAN and has Execproducer in the queue after that. RAF owes one for Smellsalot.

@Matt D: Cheers, mate for the match itself and your last post.

Nick Bockwinkel vs. Chavo Guerrero. Houston, 25th February 1983. Note the correct day, month, year format, you Americans!

As noted when I signed up for this, I'd seen very little Nick Bockwinkle. I think this might have been my first match of his. I liked how the collar and elbow tie up had a struggle to it, a gravitas if you will. One of my favourites things in wrestling is limb work with Chavo going back to the arm. Liked how Chavo really wrenched on the arm at the 5:27 mark as an example whereas sometimes wrestlers apply a submission and that's it. The body scissor is one of my least favourite submission moves but I overcame that here thanks to Bock selling the effects of the armwork Chavo's put in grabbing at his bicep. I want more of that in wrestling, selling. Biggest testament I can put into the match is that my jaw dropped at the finish as I thought Bock would win even though it was a non title match. Cheers, Matt. Will get a match out to you.

[The Natural]

On 12/10/2022 at 2:37 PM, Matt D said:

Ok, so we have TWELVE people. That's a lot of people. Some are new. That's great.

Remember, most important thing is to give your partner a match. If you think you won't check the board for a few days, well, try to sneak in on Saturday to do that much at least. Nothing over 30. Hear what your partner has to say. Don't worry about killing yourself on the review. Did you like it or not. What worked/what didn't? What stood out? What surprised you? Etc.

By the way, I'll take whatever. I watch enough wrestling along the lines of what I'm wanting to watch that it's pretty easy. I mean, don't give me Omega/Okada or anything. If you really need help and have the knowledge, post 87 Maeda, pre-AEW Darby Allin, the very best SHIMMER had to offer, CMLL from the last couple of years, but just surprise me really.

@Execproducer
@SirSmellingtonofCascadia
---
@The Natural
@Curt McGirt
---
@porksweats
@Gordlow
---
@Sammo~!
@John E. Dynamite
---
@Super Ape
@DEAN
---
Matt D
@thee Reverend Axl Future

RAF,
Maniac Matt Borne in South Africa against a Otto Wanz-ian local hero.

 

@Matt D:

For you we have not only a Darby Allin match before AEW, an even rarer sight without the blonde hair and facepaint. Had to do some digging for the date, 22nd March 2018. I hope you like it!

[DEAN]

@Execproducer please enjoy Stan the Lariat Hansen and Crusher Blackwell beating each other to death.

 

 

[Gordi the former AEW fan]

What did all y'all get for Christmas? Me? Oh, I got TWO NEW GIANTS! I love prowrestling giants. I haven't got around to justifying it in my thread but Andre is all time top ten for me and Baba is damned close, as well as being the greatest booker and promoter of all time in my opinion. But... El Gigante and Khali were the drizzling shits. There's more to it than just being an actual giant. I think that Vince or Cornette or someone could have made a star out of Giant Tataki. He clearly gets it, but also very clearly lacks reps and guidance. I haven't seen a ton of Panamanian wrestling (maybe ONE other match also connected to Secret Santo and/or Matt or Segunda) but it LITERALLY seems like someone explained it to Sandokan and he kind of got it and explained it fairly well to some other Panamanian dudes and they kind of tried to work it out as they went along. This as opposed to what happened in Japan where dudes like Blassie were present and involved and therefore the pacing and storytelling in Rikidozan matches are miles better than in Sandokan matches. The crowd reactions in Panama are pretty great, though. They were definitely doing something right. This particular match is pretty surreal. Tataki (which is the name of my favourite food in the whole world, so I am predisposed to love the guy) is Andre-level hyperpituitary. Broad and thick as well as tall. And he's VERY agile for his size (a theme in my Christmas matches, as it turns out). There are two good guys facing one giant bad guy and he's giant enough that it really doesn't seem entirely unfair. They stick and move, dodge, jump up on each other's shoulders... They really fight the way you'd figure two argonauts would have to try and battle a cyclops or something along those lines. And if Tataki gets hold of either of them, he just utterly lays them out. It's pretty cool. Until the end where, no fooling, the good guys kick the giant right in the nuts and when he rolls out of the ring in agony they bury him in chairs while the crowd explodes with joy. Perhaps morality works differently in Panama. The ending brings to mind Brian Cage in the first Casino Battle Royal, similarly buried in plunder (if I'm remembering correctly. Was it Cage? or maybe Archer?) And in Christmas match no. 2 The Machine takes on Konga Kong in an all-time great around-five-minute match. Good Heavens this match is a  spectacle! Konga Kong is  Kokina Maximus sized! Calling him 400 pounds seems to be underselling it. And he is AGILE for his size! At one point, Cage gets him up for a powerbomb (which is an insane feat of strength already) but then Konga Kong counters into a RANA. It is one of the most astonishing spots I have EVER seen. It's well worth the hassle of waiting for the video to debuff on dailymotion. Really, everyone, have a look at that rana. Cage also CATCHES a diving Kong and there are ALMOST too many absurd size/strength/agility "how is that even possible?!!?" spots in such a short amount of time. It's video game wrestling but with an actual steroid monster and obese giant doing the impossible things. I REALLY hope Konga Kong is still wrestling. I want him to pop up in AEW and get involved with Cage, Toa Liona, and company, and also with Bear Boulder, Keith Lee, and Claudio. I want him to rana out of a Wardlow Powerbomb Symphony. Finally, Stevens vs Fuller is EXACTLY the kind of match that would be so much fun to see live. Two good wrestlers playing to a hot crowd, each reacting to the other. The true art of prowrestling. And Rick Fuller is damn near the Platonic Ideal of the local indie tough guy champion. Thanks, Matt! What a great Christmas gift.

[SirSmUgly]

12 hours ago, Sammo~! said:

This match is from 2005, so I don't know if that qualifies as early-era enough for you, but I adore this match. KENTA and Shibata were an absolute badass unit as the Takeover. KENTA as the shit talking little prick who would often write checks with his mouth that his ass can't cash, and Shibata as the cool, collected older brother type who steps in when things get out of hand. Morishima is an absolute unstoppable shitkicker. Also Muhammad Yone is there. 
 

 

As I am not knowledgeable about good lucha or joshi, I'll just put in front of you stuff that I recently watched for the first time in a long time and liked. 

Jeff Jarrett and DDP had many matches in WCW, but their first one on TV was probably the best one, so here ya go!

https://www.dailymotion.com/video/x2c7eaj

[Matt D]

@GordlowThings are a tad bit dire here at the Matt D house this Xmas, but your post made my day and was well-needed and well-received. Thank you for that.

Spoiler

I didn't realize you weren't aware of Kongo Kong. Here's the seminal Kongo Kong match

 

 

[The Natural]

37 minutes ago, Matt D said:

@GordlowThings are a tad bit dire here at the Matt D house this Xmas, but your post made my day and was well-needed and well-received. Thank you for that.

  Reveal hidden contents

I didn't realize you weren't aware of Kongo Kong. Here's the seminal Kongo Kong match

 

 

@Matt D: Sorry to hear/read that. Virtual hugs xxx.

[John E. Dynamite]

edit: joy, it's a christmastime double post. stay safe out there everyone, try using applejack in yr eggnog

Edited December 24, 2022 by John E. Dynamite

[John E. Dynamite]

  

On 12/17/2022 at 6:20 PM, Gordlow said:

 

 

I have VERY specific memories of this match! It was my 46th birthday. There were a handful of very friendly folks from Cirque de Soliel KOOZA at this show, on their day off. We got drunk together. This match blew their mind! Imagine a pro wrestling match that could blow the mind of The King of the Clowns. They were marking out really hard.

Konaka = Pale One teaming with Black Buffalo and Naoki Setoguchi also doing Pale One gimmicks vs my special friend Apple Miyuki and the Shirai sisters in cute cosplay!

This might be the MOST 2007-2015 Osaka-style match of all time. Thanks to my other special friend Kyusei Ninja Ranmaru for posting this on her most excellent YouTube channel.

While I was posting this, I got a pop-up notice that it is referee Matsui's birthday today! I'll take that as a sign that today is a good day for Osaka nostalgia. 

Hey Matt! You should watch this one, too. It's pretty weird and entertaining.

Oh gawd, I got my ass kicked trying to run a liquor store during Christmas week AND the next round of pairings got announced early. OK, I kept the store open late even after people stopped showing up. The match has been watched.

--

So I am a theater guy. That’s my background, I do/did the acting thing for a lot of my life. Legit training since I was a kid, college degree in it and everything. Very little singing and dancing, a whole bunch of doing avant-funny stuff in front of small houses. So this kind of pro wrestling strikes a mood that I am very, very comfortable with. I’m almost jealous of it. I even backyarded my ass off in high school when my anemic Catholic school was cutting budgets to everything extracurricular. I never dared to book anything that tied together the terrifying worlds of AVANT GARDE THEATER and JAPANESE INDY SLEAZE~ Oh but how I would have loved to. And so I do the vicarious thing with this match and with all the weird stuff Konaka = Pale One (Pehlwan?) is doing.

Konaka’s leg fold gimmick should remind everyone of Orange Cassidy’s current hands-in-the-pocket gimmick. You’re intentionally taking away one of your own body parts as a way of disrupting your opponents rhythm and getting in their head, as well as forcing yourself to generate unorthodox offense. It’s very drunken kung-fu, ain’t it? And yeah it’s just a guaranteed pop and a guaranteed way to stand out if you do it well. The kind of thing that plays well to any house.  Konaka really reminds me of Kinya Oyanagi as well, the T2P guy. Oyanagi had the student gimmick where he was constantly reading a book, and he’d apply submissions so he could take a seat and study a little harder. That one was more prop-based as he’d play keep-away or pass the book off to people when he needed to, but it still had that cadence of Japanese slapstick to it.

Apply Miyuki was a little charisma explosion back in the day. You watch somebody like Lulu Pencil get some love from the AEW fanbase and you have to think Apple woulda benefited from an outlet like that, if there was any major US promotion active in 2005-ish that coulda featured her. But IIRC she could work pretty good and she could BUMP. Man she’s a great old face. Haven’t seen her in too long. And of course we all miss Mio, and my memories of Black Buffalo are positive ones, and I have no clue who the other guy is. The world-famous Io Shirai playing the straight man felt right. Apple getting the pin felt right. This clicked. And man what a neat little venue. The thing I truly despise the most about the WWE monopoly years was the continued shaming of “bingo hall” pro wrestling. The thing I truly despise about capitalist corporate homogenized big-money bullshit American entertainment is the idea that things aren’t valid unless they cost a lot of money to make. I don’t know what part of the typical mass-media consuming populace even bother to see little shows with sub-200 crowds and it hurts my brain and soul to think about. This match is people, being artistically creative and athletically capable on their own terms, trying (and succeeding) to entertain a crowd that they can immediately see and interact with. Cirque du Soliel people are, God bless em, always gonna understand the value of human expression for a human purpose. None of my best memories of watching live theater happened on Broadway. Most of my best wrestling memories are from venues no bigger than ECW arena, when I got to feel like I was connected to the performers and the other people around me. Matches like this just make me want to support community theater and indie wrestling and every weird 200 seat thing in the world.

Edited December 24, 2022 by John E. Dynamite

[Matt D]

On 12/24/2022 at 9:12 AM, The Natural said:

@Matt D:

For you we have not only a Darby Allin match before AEW, an even rarer sight without the blonde hair and facepaint. Had to do some digging for the date, 22nd March 2018. I hope you like it!

Ok, we're playing musical chairs as I'm downstairs as the wife (5 doses into Paxlovid) and the 10 year old (spiked her fever last night) are upstairs and the 5 year old (no fever yet) is still asleep. So I figured I'd watch this one to catch up from last week.

It's interesting. Darby with the hair reminded me of Eccleston for a minute. More for a dark elf than for Doctor Who. It took me a minute to figure that out though and i was weirdly thinking Daniel Craig for a moment which made me want to see Darby Allin as an eccentric detetctive solving murders. Anyway what was really interesting was how he hadn't quite refined the act like he has in the almost five years since. It was little things; his comeback was a small package, which led into a chance at offense but then he went with a slam (and hit it) before getting cut off. I don't think he'd do that slam now. I think he'd stay laser focused on roll-ups and tossing his body at Sami. He did do a bunch of that, of course. I liked how Sami took over for the first time (after some admittedly dancy reversals) with a big German but Darby landed on his feet with the second. This was best when Sami was really in charge and Darby had to work from underneath. Some of Sami's stuff like the pile driver on the apron was just grisly. Darby's best when he is able to get an advantage by throwing himself at his opponent but then pays for it because it's a bottomless well but one that he goes back to too often. It's interesting personally how much credibility he's built up with me as it pertains to his resilience. Some of the comebacks and the more even stuff later on wouldn't work for me if I had seen this cold in 2018 but works for me now because I believe in the character of Darby Allin (and in the human being portraying him). He's invested me in his journey over the last year and a half and that means I suspend disbelief where I might not with other wrestlers. They had a big pick-up the pace moment in the middle which I bought due to Darby's resilience and the fact Sami hadn't taken too much damage yet. Sami kept appealing to the fans all match which paid off as they got behind Darby down the stretch and he almost lost his cool (and therefore the match). It's amazing that he's the only guy in wrestling history to really make a shoulderbreaker look devastating.

I really do wonder where Sami goes now that his MLW contract is done. Part of me hopes that Hunter is behind him and he cashes in with the Wyatt-verse because he has to be increasingly broken down and should look out for his future but if he has another big indy run, it could lead to some good stuff.

Anyway, thanks for this Paul. It was an interesting watch.

Edited December 25, 2022 by Matt D

[The Natural]

On 12/25/2022 at 2:31 PM, Matt D said:

Ok, we're playing musical chairs as I'm downstairs as the wife (5 doses into Paxlovid) and the 10 year old (spiked her fever last night) are upstairs and the 5 year old (no fever yet) is still asleep. So I figured I'd watch this one to catch up from last week.

It's interesting. Darby with the hair reminded me of Eccleston for a minute. More for a dark elf than for Doctor Who. It took me a minute to figure that out though and i was weirdly thinking Daniel Craig for a moment which made me want to see Darby Allin as an eccentric detetctive solving murders. Anyway what was really interesting was how he hadn't quite refined the act like he has in the almost five years since. It was little things; his comeback was a small package, which led into a chance at offense but then he went with a slam (and hit it) before getting cut off. I don't think he'd do that slam now. I think he'd stay laser focused on roll-ups and tossing his body at Sami. He did do a bunch of that, of course. I liked how Sami took over for the first time (after some admittedly dancy reversals) with a big German but Darby landed on his feet with the second. This was best when Sami was really in charge and Darby had to work from underneath. Some of Sami's stuff like the pile driver on the apron was just grisly. Darby's best when he is able to get an advantage by throwing himself at his opponent but then pays for it because it's a bottomless well but one that he goes back to too often. It's interesting personally how much credibility he's built up with me as it pertains to his resilience. Some of the comebacks and the more even stuff later on wouldn't work for me if I had seen this cold in 2018 but works for me now because I believe in the character of Darby Allin (and in the human being portraying him). He's invested me in his journey over the last year and a half and that means I suspend disbelief where I might not with other wrestlers. They had a big pick-up the pace moment in the middle which I bought due to Darby's resilience and the fact Sami hadn't taken too much damage yet. Sami kept appealing to the fans all match which paid off as they got behind Darby down the stretch and he almost lost his cool (and therefore the match). It's amazing that he's the only guy in wrestling history to really make a shoulderbreaker look devastating.

I really do wonder where Sami goes now that his MLW contract is done. Part of me hopes that Hunter is behind him and he cashes in with the Wyatt-verse because he has to be increasingly broken down and should look out for his future but if he has another big indy run, it could lead to some good stuff.

Anyway, thanks for this Paul. It was an interesting watch.

@Matt D: You're welcome for my pick, Matt. Thanks again for mine and your post about me. Glad I'm not the only one who thinks Darby Allin looks like Daniel Craig. Best wishes to you and your family xxx.

Edited December 27, 2022 by The Natural

[Execproducer]

OK @DEAN a day late and always a dollar short, here is a little stocking stuffer for you featuring Mickie James and my new favorite wrestler evah!!!, Cherry Bomb (The Bunny). I had considered giving you Taeler Hendrix-Allison Kay but that thing is damned near rated R and this is the better match anyway.

I still have matches to review which I will definitely get done tomorrow. Luckily I never got my week 2 match so it'll go a little easier.

[DEAN]

Cherry Bomb vs Mickie James- Squared Circle Wrestling- 12/27/2014:  Allright!  It's the Bunny before she was Allie in IMPACT! and way before she was the Bunny!  It's Mickie James after she was Alexis Laree and after her first foray into the WWE and her first run in TNA but before her second run in the WWE.  Cherry Bomb comes out to Bad Reputation- as Cherry Bomb by the Runaways would be a little on the nose, I'm guessing.  Though Cherry Bomb is the best song Joan Jett ever played on.  This is around Mickie James 800th match and Allie's 220th-ish match.  They work a Headlock early and Allie is very intense when she applies the Head Scissors.  The crowd is behind Allie and Mickie is working slight heel.  I dig James old school stalling and punching Allie in the head on the floor.  Mickie goes COMPLETELY old school heel, fiddling with the five count and punching Allie in the face when Allie is laying on the mat.  James is great as a veteran laying out the entire match around her being a bastard.  She really gets the crowd behind Allie's struggle to survive the Lady Bill Dundee assault.  Allie goes on offense and James goes more modern after cutting her off and goes to the top rope, a very unMemphis-like thing to do.  Allie hits a Toprope Missile Dropkick FOR TWO!  Allie rolls her up and James rolls through and gets the pin!  I dig Memphis Mickie James.  I dig her punches and her CHEATING!  Allie is good as your sympathetic face, making with very fiery comebacks to James old school heel beatdowns.  It's weird that though they both were pretty far along in the careers, they really don't wrestle anything like this now.  I guess it has a lot to do with the Bunny being a fun heel and Mickie James being a wily veteran babyface.  I'm trying to remember Allie's babyface run in IMPACT! and I'm assuming it was closer to this.  Either way, this match is fun.  Mickie James will punch you right in the face.

 

[The Natural]

On 12/24/2022 at 3:14 AM, Matt D said:

Tossing Week 3 up early given the holiday and some complications we're having here at the house (the COVID sort).

Paul owes me a week 2 one (but he is good for it, dammit). Super Ape is working on one for DEAN and has Execproducer in the queue after that. RAF owes one for Smellsalot.

Here's week three though (tagging's not working tonight again).

Execproducer
DEAN
----
Matt D
Gordlow
----
The Natural
Super Ape
----
thee Reverend Axl Future
Curt McGirt
----
porksweats
John E. Dynamite
----
Sammo~!
SirSmellingtonofCascadia

Gordi, I'll have a post for you tomorrow.

 

On 12/5/2022 at 3:37 PM, Super Ape said:

I’m game.

MY TERMS:

Gotta be free on YouTube or similar as I currently have no streaming subscriptions, nor do I have any plans to get one.

No WWE or any of its subsidiaries, acquisitions or “partners,” as I am a petulant child and will not let go of an almost-sixteen-year grudge.

Beyond that? Anything goes.

I'm hoping what I found today applies to @Super Ape:

Eddie Guerrero's brief stint on the independents before returning to WWE. An up and comer in CM Punk. Whatever happened to that guy? A 20 year old match. As a bonus you get unmasked Rey Mysterio before he signs with the WWE that year. Hope you like it!

Edited December 27, 2022 by The Natural

[Matt D]

On 12/23/2022 at 11:36 PM, Gordlow said:

Oh hell yeah! Getting paired with Matt is a straight-up early Christmas present! And I know I'll be getting something good. I'll give you a choice of two shorter, VERY different pro wrestling matches. First, an atypical Fuminori Abe match:

And second an EXTREMELY neato matchup that very much delighted me by popping up in my YouTube feed the other dayyyy:

 

Emi Sakura/Masahiro Takanashi vs Rin Rin/Fuminori Abe: Choco Pro! I was disappointed from the get go that there were so many spectators since it meant people wouldn't be flipping about through the windows which is always fun. That's more of an Emi thing than a Mei thing though. We covered Takanashi vs Shiryu for SC this year, but I don't feel like I know either Takanashi or Abe well. I'd best explain the first half of this by invoking two other 2022 matches: Jeff Hardy vs Darby Allin and Cody vs Rollins. In both of those matches there was a very real sense of dread and concern, in the former for what Darby and Jeff might do to themselves and in the latter due to the very obvious physical injury Cody was working through. You found yourself wincing the whole way through but we're all jaded to a degree and none of us looked away. It a bit like this too, but on the idea that something might happen to Rin Rin. Yes, Choco Pro is fun and light to a degree, but even Takanashi grabbing her nose was worrying, because it was all to set her up for something horrible that Emi was going to do to her. Maybe it's because I'm the father of two daughters or just basic human empathy but it was churned here for dramatic effect. You cheer her successes too but you're more likely to wince with one eye shut at the profane darkness that is Emi's wrath. The back half opened up to Abe finally figuring out how to deal with Emi, by countering her with singing Queen. It can't happen on Elevation unfortunately since they'd get de-platformed or lose their monetization or something, but it'd be amazing to see Willow or someone take it to Emi like that and end up in a Queen-off. I was thinking of year end lists and while it's easy to make a list of the top 5 AEW wrestlers this year (some ranking of Moxley, Cassidy, Jericho, Dax, and Serpentico?), it's a lot tougher with the females. But Emi would be in my top 5 because she was wrestling on Elevation week in and week out and entertaining against a bevy of opponents.

Fit Finlay vs Jushin Liger: I loved the physical charisma here in general, the way that Finlay toppled out of the ring towards the end of the match or how Liger would recoil in a circle after he took a shot. Very in the moment, very working for the back row, very showing the effects of things in interesting and novel ways. Nothing was rote. What stood out as much as anything else here was how Finlay's end was always violence, was always getting a shot in and hurting Liger. He'd come up with any number of ways to get him in position: pulling the hair, pulling the top of the mask, using a nerve hold, putting him on the apron pulling back the head, but it was always about setting up a hard shot. It was always about inflicting pain and never about a "spot." It was just opening the door in any way he could to some hard shot. If he was in there with a wrestler with a different mask or with a beard or with a singlet or whatever, you just got the sense he'd use the tools available to him to accomplish his end. It's weird seeing a lot of UWF-fighting Yamada and then Liger here. Some people had Muta or Kabuki; I had Liger as the height of my WCW watching as a kid was probably December 1991-March 1992. So he'd always been something magical and mystical for me. To see him as Yamada really grinding on the mat was great. But it's also amazing how he transformed himself into Liger. I wouldn't say this had a lot of complex sequences; instead Finlay based and grounded and Liger fought from underneath and ultimately overcame but the high spots were sufficiently high.

It's been quite a journey this week and I was glad to have these. Thanks Gordi.

Edited December 28, 2022 by Matt D

[John E. Dynamite]

@porksweats I can't seem to figure out how to search through anybody's post history, so I wasn't able to fine-tune this pick as much as I'd have liked to. But seeing how AEW is going through a bout of J-e-Double-F J-a-Double-MANIA~ I figured I'd stick to the week's theme and find some Jarrett-on-TV stuff.

CACTUS JACK SMACK ATTACK - Jeff Jarret vs. Scott Steiner- TNA Wrestling IMPACT, airdate 4/23/2009

https://archive.org/details/tna-i-mpact-2009.02.05/TNA+iMPACT+2009.04.23.mp4
(timestamp = 1:09:00 for pomp and circumstance, 1:11:27 for entrances)

The absolute apex of Jeff Jarrett's TNA run is, without question, his matches against Kurt Angle. The NO DQ Match, the Foley guest ref clusterfuck, the 2/3 Falls Cage Match are all really rather brilliant. Those are too obvious, AND they're all free on YouTube so feel free to watch them if that sounds better than this. But this match here w/ Scott Steiner is that perfect blend of deadly serious violence and cross-eyed goofball charm, with two guys who are absolute emperors of those borderlands. Not to mention third man in the commentary booth / then-TNA champ Mick Foley knows his way around that neighborhood pretty well. I only knew this match from the .gifs (pogo stick, USE MY SIGN) but it turns out it's an exceptional TV main event. The only thing that made me hesitate was that Jarrett's the babyface in this one, but then something Christmas-y went down in the match and I stuck with it.

I'm realizing that old TNA is a lot more fun in 2022 then when it was happening. Back in the day we were wondering why the booking wasn't competent and why we couldn't have a WWE alternative that didn't constantly shoot itself in the foot, but now that we've got through the hump and all that anxiety is gone, you can finally enjoy the product for what it is. I'd love to call this match very Attitude Era, or very Memphis, but it isn't. It's very TNA (which is to say, occasionally competent 00's WCW), and it's better for it.

Edited December 29, 2022 by John E. Dynamite

[Curt McGirt]

Sorry, I haven't seen the thread additions until just now. I'll get something for you soon good Reverend. Got tomorrow off so I'll do it then unless I think of something tonight (and it'll be hard to think of honestly haha). 

[Curt McGirt]

Here you go, Rev: 

Magnum T.A. vs. Mr. Wrestling II (1984/03/23) - YouTube

and the follow-up

Magnum T.A. vs. Mr. Wrestling II (1984/04/06) - YouTube

I figured I'd toss you something that probably gives you the warm fuzzies. And BONUS for those who don't know the history behind II and TA...

https://youtu.be/yQ2qRlr1ddg

Thoughts from me later. Anyway, I actually thought of this because DEAN referenced II's kneelift in his review of the Shida/Hayter Dynamite match which I passed through in catching up with the board. Nice coincidence! 

[Curt McGirt]

On 12/18/2022 at 6:58 AM, DEAN said:

I wonder how many matches she had in America before she toned that down.

Has she? 

EDIT: Also, to Matt, Callihan has been working in Impact again since leaving MLW.

Edited December 29, 2022 by Curt McGirt

[John E. Dynamite]

On 12/23/2022 at 11:50 PM, porksweats said:

For you John E., some non WWE/NJPW wrestling from 2009

 

 

I first saw these two dudes live on the same night. CZW Cage of Death 6, I talk about it a lot but it was a formative show for me. Steen tagged with Generico vs. Excalibur & Super Dragon in the consensus match of the night (I mighta went Dutt vs. M-Dogg but what do I know) which was the follow-up to IWS's breakout summer in the states. Those were good times... Claudio was still Chris Hero's young boy and had showed up to help set up the ring. It was then I realized how BIG he was, and I hoped he was gonna wrestle that night. He totally didn't, it was a bummer.

This match is a weird one! For the first ten minutes this winds up being an indieriffic silly one-cum-studio TV brawl where the meat of the match is Steen jawjacking with a hot, chirpy, drunk crowd + mid-match microphone work (from Claudio??). Eventually they have to start providing the wrestling match that everybody paid for, and y'know they're pretty really good at that and have a bit of chemistry. This is singles match #3 between the two, out of 19. In case you're counting. Seriously, this crowd is so drunk. An entire row of Labatt-soaked twentysomething CAW editors stand up and chant "FULL STEEN AHEAD" like it's clever. But they're the back row, and they aren't blocking anyone's view, so it's OK - so very Canadian. This match really really bodes well for these two guys' careers as Sports Entertainers because they coulda played this straight and went boomboomworkrate but they read the room and lead with their personalities instead of their moves.

This is wishful thinking, but I hope the kids really do subscribe to Honor Club when ROH does their streaming TV thing and dabble in this universe. I hope Gen Z smart marks get around to their critical reassessment of 00's indie wrestling sooner than later, starting off with known quantities like Steen and Claudio and ending up in the weeds watching a bunch of Emil Sitoci and Chris Bosh and Jigsaw. We can only hope.

Also, this venue gets run all the time, right? This is where Chikara used to run, where Chuck Taylor and Archibald Peck goofed on the big-ass paintings on the wall? Love this venue. Pops up on YouTube a lot and it's always a good sign.

[thee Reverend Axl Future]

Sri Curt McGirt, I gots a hot one for ye -

https://youtu.be/QB1ne62O1nw

The Fantastics vs D C "Mad Dog" Drake & Damien Kane, 1988(?)

It's a cliche to state that The Fantastics are criminally overlooked, but it's true. RAF will proselytize for DC Drake all day long. Reinforcing the proto-TSWA/ECW connection is his manager/cohort Damien Kane and a skinny lil' Paul E. Dangerly. Classic tag team fairground fun.

I noticed that my picks thus far have skewed in a "sleazy characters" manner, so I will roll with that from here on out. Note: the "sleazy" may only refer to one's gimmick, and not necessarily towards the worker's lifestyle or moral compass, and at any rate the "sleaziness" may only exist in RAF's eyes alone. Let's hear it for the scum!

[Curt McGirt]

Mmmm more Fantastics... me likey.

[SirSmUgly]

OK, I see I have a couple of matches to catch up with. Let's give them a look: 

Kevin Sullivan and Buzz Sawyer vs. Robbie Idol and Ian Panzer

As something of a connoisseur of Kevin Sullivan squashes, I have seen this match before and enjoyed it immensely. The perk of this match, barring the post-match interview shenanigans, is Sawyer looking like he's/actually shoot being high on bath salts during the whole thing. The Sullivan's Slaughterhouse deal, which is my first memory of Mick Foley in wrestling, turned out quite a few enjoyable squashes!

The match itself is a fine squash specifically because of Sawyer, yeah, whose nutty laughing is a bit much, but who also is basically mean, even meaner than Sully is. I watched a bunch of Matt Borne-as-Doink squashes last night that had that quality of meanness that makes for a good heel squash, so I was primed to watch Buzz Sawyer bite and claw dudes. I also greatly enjoyed the SWEET top-rope splash Mad Dog hit, though the second one wasn't quite as good as the first. But whatever, Buzz bites the SHIT out of Robbie Idol and no one can get him off, and even more than the job squad not being able to pry him off is Sullivan being like FUCK, I GOTTA GO GET THE CHAIN and stomping off to do it before returning and choking Sawyer out with it

Post-match, we get an interview with a long bleep that covers up Sullivan basically saying that Buzz's mom popped a squat in the desert and shit her son from the womb. How the fuck did this get on TV at all? It rules. I love Cactus standing there looking like a relatively balanced dude next to these two nutjobs.

Southern wrestling is the best.

Katsuyori Shibata and KENTA vs. Takeshi Morishima and Muhammad Yone

I know three of these guys, not well, but decently enough. I really enjoyed Morishima's ROH stuff back in the day and am sorry to hear of his recent substance abuse/health issues. SAMMO~! notes that KENTA is perfect as a total prick, and he is! He was totally miscast as a stoic babyface in NXT in the mid-New Tens because his face screams "total dickwad."

While this match was a bit long for me and probably could have been edited down a bit, it was solid because the personalities came through. Some of the tropes, I'm not a fan of, like the opening "let's forearm/punch each other in the face a lot" spot that seems du jour for like every match from a major Japanese wrestling company that I see in this time period. KENTA's great, though, with the little boot wipes and disrespectful kicks and slaps. 

The match was better when it picked up and worse when they worked holds in the center of the ring that just felt like passing time. Also, Shibata is a plus-striker (and that's an understatement), so I felt like the match was way more interesting when everyone kept it standing. 

But I can't hate the overarching framework of this match, in which Shibata would walk around like a boss kicking people in the liver or head or whatever, and then KENTA would tag in and do boot wipes and nut shots and other dirty and disrespectful offense. The thread of this match, which is that you the viewer are desperately hoping the whole time that KENTA gets in over his head without Shibata being there to save him, comes right through. It worked for me on a macro level and was generally okay on a micro level despite my previous complaints. 

Let's give love to the really good micro level stuff, actually:

• KENTA doing increasingly ludicrous offense that is designed to make him look like a cocky asshole, mixing it up and hitting as many different spots in that vein as he could. I am a sucker for "heel runs the ropes like five times just to slap someone" as a spot and feel that it isn't used enough. 
• Shibata kicking dudes.
• The faces getting bursts of nasty offense, hitting it, and KENTA laying there like he's just waiting for the coroner to pronounce him dead. 
• The finishing run being pretty hot. The run is that KENTA keeps barely getting saved from a three count after successive moves by Shibata breaking up the pinfall, and eventually Morishima hits a sequence of nasty suplexes while Yone holds onto Shibata for dear life on the outside as the faces finally score a pinfall. That was really good because I think I bit on two of the near-falls before the actual fall came. REALLY well-constructed and nicely executed. 

That was good pro wrestling right there, I'll tell you. 

 

Edited December 31, 2022 by SirSmellingtonofCascadia

[Matt D]

Week 4! Sorry I'm a little late. I was early last week. We're still getting over COVID here. Happy New Years everyone. I also got distracted by Rampage and This 1981 Anibal/Dr. Wagner Sr tag match that just popped up and 1990 AJPW and family stuff and whatever else. So, Week 4.

I assume everyone's up to date. Will check next week. Tagging's not working unfortunately.

Execproducer
porksweats
----
Curt McGirt
Gordlow
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Matt D
Sammo~!
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John E. Dynamite
SirSmellington
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Super Ape
thee Reverend Axl Future
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The Natural
DEAN

Sammo~! I'll get something for you tonight.

[Matt D]

On 12/9/2022 at 3:42 PM, Sammo~! said:

I've wanted to do one of these for a while. I'm in. I'll watch anything you put in front of me, but I'm especially interested in watching good Joshi and good Lucha.

Sammo~!

I've got you this week. Here's a match between Negro Casas and Mocho Cota that showed up in the last year or two. It's in the midst of their feud. It's a great look at both of them being all time characters, pretty heated, and actually better than their hair match that followed:

 

 

 

Edited December 31, 2022 by Matt D