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AEW - OCTOBER 2022


The Natural
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22 minutes ago, Greggulator said:

I think Sammy would be about 20,000 times better if he came up through NXT. There is a giant track record of people in NXT who learned how to perform as a character. Sami Zayn is probably the best in the world right now and until he signed with NXT he was under a mask pretending to be Mexican. 

Sammy has the tools. He has a great pretty boy look. He's athletic as hell. But aside from public displays of affection with Tay is a crummy promo and doesn't know when to be vicious or when to be a cheap shot artist or when to look to the crowd for heat. That kind of stuff is really hard to learn. But he's in constant matches and the like with Chris Jericho, who is one of the best ever at the subtle timing needed in wrestling. But learning it once a week from Jericho (or if they train together at all elsewhere, which I doubt) isn't enough.  

Sammy has also been really bad with cursing in promos or giving the finger or etc. All of that just tells me that he's never really worked on promos, or he doesn't know why a promo is a good promo, and he doesn't know how to work as a character. I think he'd be in a better situation where he'd have more guardrails.

WWE used to actively encourage wrestlers to take acting lessons and even brought in outside coaches to help the talent get better. Being the Elite and their promo style always comes across as "people who have never been trained to act doing what they think is acting".

It's cute for a web series, but on TV it just comes across as really bad

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Andrade was waaaay more entertaining in his backstage skits like trying to buy Darby from 'Stink' or his nonsense with Hardy or anything with Jose than Sammy ever was with his stupid cue card gimmick (which was meant to keep people from changing channels but was an instant channel changer for me).  I liked him as the cocky kid in the IC but he hasn't progressed much beyond that and I thought his babyface run and the stuff with Fuego was dire

I'm probably more forgiving of Andrade's booking because I've enjoyed him in AEW way more than I did in WWE.  I'd outright say he's one of my favorites in the company at this point.  I think he's had some dope matches that he never would have had there, and the character feels authentic.  He's a solid upper-midcarder who could be moved up easily.  But he's run into the same problem a lot of others have in AEW, not enough top spots for all the top talent.  He came in when the company was already loaded and then got leapfrogged by Punk/Bryan and (ugh) Cole.  I can understand him wanting out now too, especially with his wife in the other company, but for selfish reasons I hope he sticks around in AEW for a while.  There's still a ton of matches with him I want to see and freakin Rush just got there!!!

 

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4 hours ago, Dolphman 3000 said:

WWE used to actively encourage wrestlers to take acting lessons and even brought in outside coaches to help the talent get better. Being the Elite and their promo style always comes across as "people who have never been trained to act doing what they think is acting".

It's cute for a web series, but on TV it just comes across as really bad

Christopher Daniels and R.J. City hinted that they have similar thoughts on the latest Hey! (EW)

 

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I agree with much of the above in theory but let's also keep in mind that NXT is no guarantee you'll learn how to navigate acting and promos. Kyle O'Reilly (to go with an extreme example) has great looking offence but his acting and facials are from planet x and his promos are some of the worst in the business (with the lowpoint being his "falling over drunk on champagne" bit when him, Cole and Fish were celebrating after stealing all the belts). 

Edited by Belgian_Waffle
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7 hours ago, Dolphman 3000 said:

WWE used to actively encourage wrestlers to take acting lessons and even brought in outside coaches to help the talent get better. Being the Elite and their promo style always comes across as "people who have never been trained to act doing what they think is acting".

It's cute for a web series, but on TV it just comes across as really bad

Counterpoint: almost every pro wrestler who has trained as an actor has come back to pro wrestling and been terrible at acting in that context. Edge is the most egregious example. 

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15 hours ago, Infinit said:

For those who have been to AEW shows...what is the tshirt selection like their stands??

I was at a Philly show and was shockingly let down at the selection.  I ended up just grabbing a hat and a Dustin Rhodes figure.  I got tickets to Rampage/Full Gear so I'm hoping that I can pickup something.

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1 hour ago, Log said:

Counterpoint: almost every pro wrestler who has trained as an actor has come back to pro wrestling and been terrible at acting in that context. Edge is the most egregious example. 

Word.  Cody always came across as disingenuous and acting was his first career choice.

Everything @Greggulator said about Sammy is spot on.  He used to wear a panda head to the ring and when asked what that had to do with anything, his reply was something like, "I just think pandas are cool."  Kid gives zero thought to any aspect of wrestling that's not "what dumb shit can I do in the next match and how many flips can I add to said dumb shit?"

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1 hour ago, Technico Support said:

Word.  Cody always came across as disingenuous and acting was his first career choice.

Everything @Greggulator said about Sammy is spot on.  He used to wear a panda head to the ring and when asked what that had to do with anything, his reply was something like, "I just think pandas are cool."  Kid gives zero thought to any aspect of wrestling that's not "what dumb shit can I do in the next match and how many flips can I add to said dumb shit?"

That's an issue with a TON of young wrestlers. There are a million of them on the indies wearing like a skull mask or whatever to the ring because it looks cool, but has nothing to do with any sort of character thing.

And don't get me started on the random-ass poses most of them do because you have to have a random-ass pose when you get in the ring because NXT says so.

Edited by Log
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9 hours ago, Greggulator said:

I think Sammy would be about 20,000 times better if he came up through NXT. There is a giant track record of people in NXT who learned how to perform as a character. Sami Zayn is probably the best in the world right now and until he signed with NXT he was under a mask pretending to be Mexican. 

Sammy has the tools. He has a great pretty boy look. He's athletic as hell. But aside from public displays of affection with Tay is a crummy promo and doesn't know when to be vicious or when to be a cheap shot artist or when to look to the crowd for heat. That kind of stuff is really hard to learn. But he's in constant matches and the like with Chris Jericho, who is one of the best ever at the subtle timing needed in wrestling. But learning it once a week from Jericho (or if they train together at all elsewhere, which I doubt) isn't enough.  

 

Well apparently Sammy did try out for NXT.   That is where the popular clip on Twitter came where he is doing the introductions and forward rolls with him going "Baby" after saying his name and Lacey Evans was not happy with the attitude when she was coaching.  Yeah it is Lacey so what do you expect but I can't imagine that cockiness worked on other too

His skills are never his issues.  It is that he is just too goofy for his own good. 

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I guess I'm the only one who likes Sammy. He's a little lost at the present, but I like his offense. It's fast and a little sloppy. There's a degree of danger. He's toolsy and still waiting to put all of the pieces together. 

Andrade to me is a legend in his own mind. It's good to be confident but he seems higher on himself than anyone else is. The result is he is going to be disgruntled wherever he goes because no one seems to recognize how great he is. 

Generally, I'm just bummed over all of the AEW backstage stuff. Stop ruining my good time. 

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20 hours ago, The Natural said:

AEW need this man.

It took a minute for your pic to load, and I was sitting here going "Its obviously Cody..." I said it before, but after all that shit I talked earlier in the year, it's looking more and more like that dude 1) may have had a feeling where we were heading with Punk, and 2) was a little more involved with keeping folks in line in the dressing room than we may have realized.

 

21 hours ago, Greggulator said:

I think Sammy would be about 20,000 times better if he came up through NXT. There is a giant track record of people in NXT who learned how to perform as a character. Sami Zayn is probably the best in the world right now and until he signed with NXT he was under a mask pretending to be Mexican. 

Sammy has the tools. He has a great pretty boy look. He's athletic as hell. But aside from public displays of affection with Tay is a crummy promo and doesn't know when to be vicious or when to be a cheap shot artist or when to look to the crowd for heat. That kind of stuff is really hard to learn. But he's in constant matches and the like with Chris Jericho, who is one of the best ever at the subtle timing needed in wrestling. But learning it once a week from Jericho (or if they train together at all elsewhere, which I doubt) isn't enough.  

Sammy has also been really bad with cursing in promos or giving the finger or etc. All of that just tells me that he's never really worked on promos, or he doesn't know why a promo is a good promo, and he doesn't know how to work as a character. I think he'd be in a better situation where he'd have more guardrails.

I don't mean this pejoratively, because we all did it, but Sammy gives off the same energy as one of the best guys in our high school backyard fed, even down to his cadence when speaking (ironically, that guy probably blew his shot at a real wrestling career by being an asshole, to someone that's currently a champion no less, but that's a story for another day).

Edit: that is to say, that he's play wrestling and doing shit for the sake of it, and wildly overestimates at times, as though he's top yardie. Listen to the fake Rock voice.

In totality, I completely agree with the premise of your post, but I'm not sure NXT would be the place for it. I could completely see him getting the wrong message there and leaning more into the over the top facials and the 'shocked kick out face' and the 'hey, I'm loco' gesture and things like that. 

On the other hand, if not there, where? Everyone's already covered the various issues with returning to AAA, NJPW seems like a weird fit and NWA/TNA/MLW are essentially non-factors. Maybe a year or two of humble pie in the new ROH?

Edited by Zakk_Sabbath
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5 minutes ago, Zakk_Sabbath said:

I don't mean this pejoratively, because we all did it, but Sammy gives off the same energy as one of the best guys in our high school backyard fed, even down to his cadence when speaking (ironically, that guy probably blew his shot at a real wrestling career by being an asshole, to someone that's currently a champion no less, but that's a story for another day).

No, that day is today. I'm intrigued.

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20 minutes ago, Log said:

No, that day is today. I'm intrigued.

Long, infuriating story short, Top Guy got in with the right people at a local indy, and talked his way into some pre-show ring time, but balked when he found out he would be training with a woman.

Unfortunately for him, that woman ended up being Mercedes Martinez, so now he works at the grocery store.

Edited by Zakk_Sabbath
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1 hour ago, Log said:

That's an issue with a TON of young wrestlers. There are a million of them on the indies wearing like a skull mask or whatever to the ring because it looks cool, but has nothing to do with any sort of character thing.

And don't get me started on the random-ass poses most of them do because you have to have a random-ass pose when you get in the ring because NXT says so.

Or do the shocked O-Face when a move that never finishes doesn't finish. 

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1 hour ago, Log said:

And don't get me started on the random-ass poses most of them do because you have to have a random-ass pose when you get in the ring because NXT says so.

One of the many reasons I think Starks should be world champ within the next two years is he's the only guy in a country filled with guys doing dumb poses who actually seems to have understood the purpose and value of a signature pose and how to get it over. 

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Just now, Belgian_Waffle said:

One of the many reasons I think Starks should be world champ within the next two years is he's the only guy in a country filled with guys doing dumb poses who actually seems to have understood the purpose and value of a signature pose and how to get it over. 

And he kind of mixes up the way he does the pose based on how pissed he is. Like, sometimes it's more intense.

Also, my son does Starks' pose and random times and he does it VERY well.

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5 minutes ago, Log said:

And he kind of mixes up the way he does the pose based on how pissed he is. Like, sometimes it's more intense.

Also, my son does Starks' pose and random times and he does it VERY well.

I do like your family stories. Still chuckle at your son saying the scissor me line, wasn't that in front of the missus?

Edited by The Natural
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Just now, The Natural said:

I do like your stories about your son. Still chuckle at him saying the scissor me line, wasn't that in front of the missus?

Yes. Hard time explaining that one.

He also just randomly shouts out, "THE OCHO!" because of Jericho.

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4 minutes ago, Log said:

Yes. Hard time explaining that one.

He also just randomly shouts out, "THE OCHO!" because of Jericho.

Was your kid the one who called Money In The Bank "Pay The Dollars?" I know it was definitely someone here - it's been living rent-free in my head for years now.

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6 minutes ago, Zakk_Sabbath said:

Was your kid the one who called Money In The Bank "Pay The Dollars?" I know it was definitely someone here - it's been living rent-free in my head for years now.

No, but that's hilarious!

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