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AEW - OCTOBER 2022


The Natural

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1 hour ago, L_W_P said:

Should be a new rule: Nobody under 28 years old can wrestle. 

That rule would fucking suck. You're eliminating people like Billie Starkz, Nick Wayne, Jungle Boy, MJF, Riho, Toni Storm, Nixon Newell and Rhea Ripley, just to name a few.

No thanks.

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1 hour ago, L_W_P said:

Wrestling is meant to be "Soap Opera for Men" but could you imagine the cast of Days of our Lives or Neighbors bitching each other out on Twitter as constantly as these chucklefucks?

Should be a new rule: Nobody under 28 years old can wrestle. Nobody over 28 years old can wrestle until they've cleared DPPs "This guy is not a dickhead" live in life course.

I think stuff like GoT and House of the Dragon has encroached on the Soap Opera for Men territory. Also, there is some nuance with soap operas. I would say wrestling is the junior high stage play for grown men.

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14 minutes ago, Elsalvajeloco said:

I think stuff like GoT and House of the Dragon has encroached on the Soap Opera for Men territory. Also, there is some nuance with soap operas. I would say wrestling is the junior high stage play for grown men.

Oh man, now I wish TV stars DID behave like wrestlers.

The GoT cast unloading on D&D hours before the premier of Season 8 would have almost been worth it.

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2 minutes ago, SprintingFromAmerica said:

I don't mean to be *that* guy, but I need some more convincing that this isn't a work.

I'm not saying it is, but not quite ready to believe everybody this stupid yet.

I can believe the following bullet points:

- Andrade feels he's been "lost in the shuffle" in AEW 

- Sammy thinks Andrade is over-rated and lucky to be there. 

- Andrade feels that, under Triple H, he'd be a bigger star back in WWE.

- Sammy is an "AEW 4 life" kinda guy and is going all in on anyone who's not of the same mindset.

 

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What I don't get, what happened to all the unity and good feelings from two years ago?

I know there was the pandemic, so maybe there just wasn't time to build any animosity because wrestling companies were basically fighting to just stay on the air and continue putting on shows. 

But it feels like something has changed. And the biggest changes in AEW in the last year:

1. CM Punk arrives

2. Cody Rhodes leaves

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1 minute ago, TheVileOne said:

What I don't get, what happened to all the unity and good feelings from two years ago?

I know there was the pandemic, so maybe there just wasn't time to build any animosity because wrestling companies were basically fighting to just stay on the air and continue putting on shows. 

But it feels like something has changed. And the biggest changes in AEW in the last year:

1. CM Punk arrives

2. Cody Rhodes leaves

Well something pushed Cody to leave.  Be it the Bucks and Omega or whatever but he supposedly has signed some sort of NDA so he can't dish any dirt.  Then you have all kinds of stuff which is pretty obvious.  It's the stuff Cornette talks about all the time and most of it is true.  When this all started it was All Friends Wrestling.  Bunch of guys that were relatively tight with each other pushing the narrative that they were fighting the evil empire run by the out of touch billionaire and they were going to present something newer and better.  Fast forward the show is successful in it's way but they haven't been able to grow the product.  Tony fell into all the old traps every other promotion did.  Someone comes available sign them.  Do you have a place for them?  Doesn't mater he likes to Tweet how such and such is All Elite.  He has fallen in love with the super special surprise happening all the time.  Saraya gets a nice pop then you realize you are paying her a lot of money to maybe wrestle and to deliver stiff awkward promos.  But hey you got that one time pop.  The forbidden door stuff is great but you wonder how much discontent that brings up with the roster when they dont get booked on the big shows.  And the big thing is signing all the HHH loyal guys who never thought in a million years Vince would ever go away.  Now they have remorse.  Tony wants to be buddies with everyone but obviously the company structure is all wrong.  Tony hires all these people to fill these backstage roles but it sounds like they don't have much authourity. Dealing with wrestlers is like herding cats and Tony has let this get away from him. He is spinning too many plates.  He isn't stopping with the signings so he needs to release guys or find out who isn't happy and send them home and pay them out.    If you have even 10% of the roster unhappy that can drag down 100% of the product.  

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39 minutes ago, TheVileOne said:

What I don't get, what happened to all the unity and good feelings from two years ago?

I know there was the pandemic, so maybe there just wasn't time to build any animosity because wrestling companies were basically fighting to just stay on the air and continue putting on shows. 

Relationships naturally fray over time. Moreover, very few people are going to put out there true thoughts at the beginning. Also, I think a lot of it was an us vs. them mentality as far AEW having this proxy war with WWE by going against NXT. Now that it's over, you can redirect all that energy and animosity in house.

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2 hours ago, TheVileOne said:

What I don't get, what happened to all the unity and good feelings from two years ago?

I know there was the pandemic, so maybe there just wasn't time to build any animosity because wrestling companies were basically fighting to just stay on the air and continue putting on shows. 

But it feels like something has changed. And the biggest changes in AEW in the last year:

1. CM Punk arrives

2. Cody Rhodes leaves

Khan says he and only he writes the show. Worse .. he only writes an ‘outline’. They ran through their foundation-storylines 12-18 months ago, culminating with Page winning the title. As was apparent at the time, they clearly had no idea what to do next. They got by with the short-term dopamine hits of a host of debuts (Andrade, Punk, Danielson, Lee, Black etc) but there was obviously no foresight in booking here either as the only momentum they even vaguely capitalised on was Punk/MJF. Throw all this disorganised, short-sighted decision making into a pot, sprinkle growth-stagnation then allow to boil for a year and you get a shit show of malcontent. Won’t be a particular Cody/Punk issue .. Rhodes was the worst of them all for wanting what was best for himself. Don’t forget a lot of the founding-roster were probably just deliriously happy to have spots on tv to begin with.

With all the off screen comments of “bringing reality” into the product / learning from UFC etc one may think they calculated to go one way .. but that seems to give far too much credit for the thinking. Watching that Helwani vid he looks like a really, really tired kid who still doesn’t want to share the toys or control of “his” show.

 

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1 hour ago, A_K said:

Khan says he and only he writes the show. Worse .. he only writes an ‘outline’. They ran through their foundation-storylines 12-18 months ago, culminating with Page winning the title.

 

Think there’s an element of truth to this.  It sounds like “difficult second album” syndrome, where a bands spends all those years in their garage writing their hit first album, then when the second album comes out they’ve been on tour for 18 months, chucked into a studio and told “write a great album in 3 months”.  

TK will have had all these great ideas which he has burned through and we are left going “yeah, that was last year, what do you have now”, it’s the reason head coaches come and go in real sports, it’s not that they become bad coaches but things change which they can’t handle.

 

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I see this more as an MCU thing where you build up to the big Endgame (Page winning the title) and once you do that you need to let things cool down, you need to start establishing new people or new stories, and things are going to be kinda eh for awhile until you start working towards the next big moment. And given that this is pro wrestling, injuries along the way or wrestlers being babies don't help.

TK deserves more credit than he gets because they have had engaging storylines since Page won the title, they have had mini-big moments, he has used Moxley extremely well as his proper ace of the company, etc. Is TK perfect? Not even close and there is a little too much start stop to too many feuds where that worked early on because it helped establish who hated who and who like who. Now it doesn't work as well because you have guys disappear without any reason for long periods of time. Even a mention of someone going through injury troubles or working on their craft in Dark or Elevation before they felt comfortable about being back on Dynamite would be at least some kind of a halfway decent explanation for the folks that just totally disappear from Dynamite and Rampage.

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AEW also (for some storylines) simultaneously has the dual issues of not knowing when to pull the trigger, and once the arch is over the best way to use the wrestler. I appreciate long-term storytelling but I also think its important for promoters to listen to the crowd. If something isn't working, change it, and if something is working you weren't expecting to work, adjust. When dealing with a live crowd you have to be flexible, sure sometimes you stick with the story but other times just go with the flow. There is no reason that Jamie Hayter should still be with Britt Baker, for example. Don't drag it out so long that people lose interest.

I respect that booking a wrestling show is hard. Managing the wrestlers, figuring out what the fans will react to, keeping the TV execs happy, for a weekly show is daunting. Which is a reason that TK should minimally have one or two people helping him write the shows that aren't the wrestlers on the shows. The honeymoon period is over, any ideas he had in his head three years ago have completed, they have to get things in order or they are in trouble. I think their wrestlers are great, and the in-ring product is still great, but I hope that TK can look at the big picture and see the areas he needs help. I want AEW to be successful, having a legit #2 promotion is great for fans and for wrestlers.

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Andrade/Sammy update:

Quote

Both Sammy Guevara and Andrade El Idolo were both warned by AEW management on Tuesday about not fighting or else they would be sent home.

On Wrestling Observer Radio, Dave Meltzer and Bryan Alvarez discussed everything they heard in the wake of Guevara and Andrade's backstage skirmish Wednesday that resulted in the latter being sent home.

Meltzer said both men were talked to Tuesday and were told no fighting or else both would be sent home. In Andrade's case, he was told he would not be fired if he got into a fight. Both agreed and said there would be no issues.

Meltzer said he got five different accounts of what happened: three of which were identical with a fourth pretty close to the other three.

The consistent story is that Guevara did not throw any punches or fight back even after Andrade punched him, possibly a "sucker punch" according to what Meltzer and Alvarez heard. One account had Andrade spinning Guevara around, Guevara then pushing him, and Andrade punching him.

Meltzer said he had heard Andrade was waiting in a hallway for Guevara and got two punches in before it was broken up. He noted that despite the punches, Guevara didn't have any marks on him for his main event match on Wednesday's Dynamite. 

While Andrade's side is what was originally reported by TMZ, both Meltzer and Alvarez noted that if Guevara threw the first punch and had indeed fought Guevara, he wouldn't have worked the main event with Chris Jericho against Daniel Garcia & Bryan Danielson.

Andrade was sent home and there is no word on what AEW plans to do with him now. It was noted that he is under contract for several more years and there is speculation he would like to return to WWE -- part of the reason for this behavior this week.

Credit: f4wonline.com

 

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And that's why they can't cut Andrade, you can't set a precedent that anyone that wants out of their contract can just punch Sammy. I have conflicting internal thoughts on the whole "should promotions cut wrestlers that want to leave" debate and see both sides of it, but if someone is over-the-top acting out to get fired then firing them has the potential of hurting morale/the locker room even more than just fining/suspending them and having them stay home until they agree to knock it off.

I actually think the way they handled Black was the best way to go about it - try to talk him out of it, tell him he can have a few months paid time off to heal mentally and physically, then circle back. But Black also went about it professionally so if in a few months Black was like "its just not working out" then it would be nice if TK did let him go since at least he jobbed on the way out and by all accounts handled himself as a professional.

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10 hours ago, A.M.B. said:

Really not Hunter? Maybe I’m crazy but at this stage he’d get my vote. AEW ticket sales are way down while WWE’s are up, their ratings are up, as well as overall interest and trust with the fans again. It seems like by most metrics their booking is beating AEW’s. You can say a lot of that interest is just from Vince leaving but I think that would have fizzled out real quick is the creative wasn’t consistently solid. Sami Zayn and the bloodline is the most entertaining act in wrestling week to week for me and sure, that’s mostly on Sami being amazing, but ultimately the booker is the one giving them the time. Hunter has done a great job rehabilitating a lot of their talents.

You know that WWE just canceled a bunch of house shows due to poor ticket sales and Raw's ratings are way down, right? (Yeah I know football season started, but football wasn't a problem when the product was hot)

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11 minutes ago, Kevin Wilson said:

And that's why they can't cut Andrade, you can't set a precedent that anyone that wants out of their contract can just punch Sammy. I have conflicting internal thoughts on the whole "should promotions cut wrestlers that want to leave" debate and see both sides of it, but if someone is over-the-top acting out to get fired then firing them has the potential of hurting morale/the locker room even more than just fining/suspending them and having them stay home until they agree to knock it off.

I actually think the way they handled Black was the best way to go about it - try to talk him out of it, tell him he can have a few months paid time off to heal mentally and physically, then circle back. But Black also went about it professionally so if in a few months Black was like "its just not working out" then it would be nice if TK did let him go since at least he jobbed on the way out and by all accounts handled himself as a professional.

I don't know. I personally think it'd be pretty hilarious if people figured out that punching Sammy could get you whatever you wanted from TK.

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I think a pretty good punishment/rib would be to go the WWE route of breaking up Sammy and Tay onscreen. He’s cooled off because he loses the best part of his act, plus they can stress him out by pairing her with an irresistible stud like, say, Serpentico. 

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Personally, I think it would be fucking hilarious if the way to get out of your contract was by punching the shit out of Sammy.

EDIT: Aw shit, Log said it before me.

Edited by Craig H
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1 hour ago, Kevin Wilson said:

AEW also (for some storylines) simultaneously has the dual issues of not knowing when to pull the trigger, and once the arch is over the best way to use the wrestler. I appreciate long-term storytelling but I also think its important for promoters to listen to the crowd. If something isn't working, change it, and if something is working you weren't expecting to work, adjust. When dealing with a live crowd you have to be flexible, sure sometimes you stick with the story but other times just go with the flow. There is no reason that Jamie Hayter should still be with Britt Baker, for example. Don't drag it out so long that people lose interest.

I respect that booking a wrestling show is hard. Managing the wrestlers, figuring out what the fans will react to, keeping the TV execs happy, for a weekly show is daunting. Which is a reason that TK should minimally have one or two people helping him write the shows that aren't the wrestlers on the shows. The honeymoon period is over, any ideas he had in his head three years ago have completed, they have to get things in order or they are in trouble. I think their wrestlers are great, and the in-ring product is still great, but I hope that TK can look at the big picture and see the areas he needs help. I want AEW to be successful, having a legit #2 promotion is great for fans and for wrestlers.

I think this is a good point and maybe the best point. Hayter is probably the best example now that the Acclaimed are getting pushed to the moon. FTR are probably right up there with Hayter as being mega over and then either not getting pushed or not even being on the show. The time to pull the trigger on Hayter was 2 weeks ago and they fucked it up. They're lucky fans are still going crazy for her. There's still time to fix that mistake and push Hayter to the moon too, but people aren't going to wait forever.

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Okay, I don't think it's a work anymore.

What was interesting is that 10 was pretty clearly losing to Andrade and taking the mask off. Presumably they're now going to have to get there some other way, though tbh I really think they should just let Dark Order have a fn moment and a few weeks with the belts.

 

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