GENERAL LUCHA LIBRE THOUGHTS in LUCHA LIBRE Posted October 24 Definitely drunk. But that is an authentic lucha crowd. They just want interaction & ended up liking the guys more who play back at them. Gresham was there to do his super serious polite applause match like he had vs Virus in a full Arena Naucalpan & it wasn't gonna fly after 2+ hours of wrestling where the crowd had already seen 3 different wrestlers work llave style matches. It's cool for the people watching online trying to decide between ***3/4 or **** but this live crowd wanted either action or entertainment. They got neither. It didn't help the crowd was like 50-60 people which is an embarassment for Ledesma. The local Sundays with zero names (mostly rookies & building locals) outdraw him these days. With a crowd that small any one comment gets heard by all. I assume you mean the "you are small" comment directed at Gresham... which is factual but that's besides the point. I've never been to a show in Mexico that didn't have people yelling out insults or jokes at the wrestlers' expense. The ones who play back at them are the ones who end up the most over. I just re-subbed to IWTV to catch up on Lucha Memes & Lee Moriarty gets a similar reaction in Battle of Coacalco. Even the same chants. Yet by the end of round 1 he's cheered by everyone because he had a good match & didn't stop wrestling to just stare angrily at the people for daring to not sit waiting for their cue to politely clap for a reversal. Lucha Libre has changed a lot over the years but drunk fans yelling dumb shit is never going away. They existed back when Atlantis & Blue Panther were working 30 minute mat matches & they'll exist 10 years from now when Destroyers are the opening spots of matches. I'm sorry if this offends anyone but those are way more authentic lucha fans than folks who talk about how great Black Terry's punches are. As long as we're discussing Memes though... wow these shows are bad. I'm not done my entire catch-up but one good match per show is literally where the bar is set. Far cry from Coacalco being packed & guys busting their asses for fans who demanded good matches. Ledesma has no idea who the good young guys in Mexico are any longer & just seems to be pairing up guys randomly. Freelance vs Perro de Guerra, Perro De Guerra vs Avisman, Avisman vs Freelance & so forth. Navarro/Terry are pretty much done no matter how much you wanna sugarcoat it. They are good for one excellent match per year if someone on the other side can carry the load. The lack of environment is a big killer as you could have a decent match end up great if the crowd is screaming, doing duel chants, chanting esto es lucha... whatever. These small crowds cannot provide that atmosphere. The real killer for me is the awful production. Ledesma often like to brag (yes, brag) he doesn't watch his own shows & it's very evident. The guy doing the production is robbing him blind by clearly just using a program that automatically makes cuts at various intervals so it looks like real editing is being done but it's just for show. No human being is making real time calls on some of these cuts. If I wasn't a hardcore lucha fan these shows would be unwatchable. I wish someone was still doing handhelds because I'd prefer those instead of cut to corner cam shooting the opposite ringpost as two guys are brawling on the floor off camera. Que?